Mary Preston interview recording, 1994 June 21 / Behind the Veil / Duke Digital Repository

Mary Jett Preston

—need to bring back the Negro spirituals in school.

0:04

Felix Armfield

They do. They do desperately.

0:08

Mary Jett Preston

They're getting them, but they're changing them.

0:09

Felix Armfield

Today is June 21st, 1994 and I'm at our Lady of Lourdes over on Napoleon and Lasalle Street in New Orleans, Louisiana. My name is Felix Armfield and I'm about to interview Ms. Mary L. Jett Preston. Ms. Preston, would you state your full name?

0:12

Mary Jett Preston

Mary Louise Jett Preston.

0:35

Felix Armfield

Okay. Ms. Preston, where are you from? Where'd you grow up?

0:38

Mary Jett Preston

I grew up in the Irish Channel.

0:41

Felix Armfield

In the Irish Channel. All right.

0:45

Mary Jett Preston

Very nice people. They just a Catholic neighborhood.

0:47

Felix Armfield

Okay. Now where is the Irish Channel located?

0:56

Mary Jett Preston

Well, I was born on St. Andrews Street, but we were located near the river on Jackson Ferry.

1:00

Felix Armfield

Jackson Ferry. Now was that a Black community or—

1:07

Mary Jett Preston

Well, it was a mixed community.

1:12

Felix Armfield

It was a mixed community.

1:13

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, maybe the Blacks were on houses facing one another on one street and maybe the Whites or Irish or Italians or whatever, our yard were they backyard, whatever the way they build the houses here in New Orleans. That's why I'm saying we weren't too segregated. We may not have spoke to one another, but we knew our neighbors, see.

1:15

Felix Armfield

Really? Now when were you born?

1:47

Mary Jett Preston

December 7th, 1931.

1:56

Felix Armfield

1931. Now tell me a little bit about—

1:57

Mary Jett Preston

During the—

1:58

Felix Armfield

Go ahead.

1:58

Mary Jett Preston

During Depression years.

1:59

Felix Armfield

Okay. What do you recall about those years?

2:01

Mary Jett Preston

Oh, like I say, my childhood was spent mostly in the country during the summer because my great-grandmother was there at the time.

2:05

Felix Armfield

And when you say the country, where was that?

2:13

Mary Jett Preston

Ferriday, Louisiana.

2:14

Felix Armfield

Ferriday?

2:14

Mary Jett Preston

Uh-huh. I remember that my Aunt Tina would pick cotton in the summer, but I didn't go to the cotton field. But someone had to be home with my grandmother while she was sick.

2:27

Felix Armfield

You would stay there—

2:38

Mary Jett Preston

I would be at home.

2:39

Felix Armfield

—with your grandmother?

2:39

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, I remember the blackberry cobblers. I remember the peach trees, fresh garden in the back of the house. I don't think they'll allow you to grow vegetable garden in your own like they used to.

2:42

Felix Armfield

Oh, really?

2:57

Mary Jett Preston

Uh-huh. They would have dried fish, smoked fish, and mostly I liked with the better beans, corn and okra. And during Christmas time, for my birthday, we would make ice cream snow. You ever had that?

2:57

Felix Armfield

No, what is ice cream snow?

3:16

Mary Jett Preston

Ice scream snow. You take the snow because it's already frozen and you make it just like you would regular ice cream.

3:19

Felix Armfield

Really?

3:28

Mary Jett Preston

And we had popcorn—

3:29

Felix Armfield

Now where would you get—

3:30

Mary Jett Preston

—for my birthday.

3:31

Felix Armfield

—the snow from? You were—

3:32

Mary Jett Preston

After the snow. Yeah, they would take it and make ice cream.

3:33

Felix Armfield

When you would get snow? You actually did get snow here in Louisiana?

3:36

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

3:38

Felix Armfield

Okay, now was this in Ferriday or in New Orleans?

3:38

Mary Jett Preston

Ferriday. We didn't get snow too much here in New Orleans, but we had ice on the ground every year. But we don't have ice now. It did freeze every year, but we didn't get snow. It was like ice. You couldn't go to school too much. We didn't have too many cars like we have now. After we went—

3:44

Felix Armfield

And this is still during the Depression years?

4:00

Mary Jett Preston

Yes. That was before the Second World War.

4:02

Felix Armfield

Okay, it was before the second.

4:08

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah. Now we were in walking distance from school. Went to James Lewis School on Chippewa Street.

4:11

Felix Armfield

Now that was here in New Orleans?

4:19

Mary Jett Preston

Yes.

4:20

Felix Armfield

Okay. Now was that pretty much a Black school here in New Orleans?

4:21

Mary Jett Preston

Yes.

4:25

Felix Armfield

And what was the name of it again?

4:25

Mary Jett Preston

James Lewis.

4:27

Felix Armfield

James Lewis. How long did you attend James Lewis?

4:28

Mary Jett Preston

Well, we went from first to the eighth grade, then we went on to high school. We would catch the streetcar or the bus.

4:34

Felix Armfield

The streetcar, okay.

4:43

Mary Jett Preston

The streetcar would take me to the—That was the Cleveland bus or something. We had to transfer to get to Booker Washington.

4:48

Felix Armfield

You went to Booker Washington High School.

4:54

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah. Mm-hmm.

4:56

Felix Armfield

Now when was this that you went to Booker Washington?

4:58

Mary Jett Preston

Oh, I graduated January of 1950. Well, we attended about four years of high school.

5:00

Felix Armfield

Okay. You graduated in 1950 from Booker Washington High School. What was your education like there at Booker Washington?

5:06

Mary Jett Preston

Well, I didn't want to believe I deserved all those honors, but as I got older, I appreciate what they had done. But I wasn't able to go to college at that time. My mother and father got sick. My daddy got hurt on the river with a broken back.

5:13

Felix Armfield

Your father got hurt on the river. What kind of work was your daddy doing on the river?

5:30

Mary Jett Preston

He worked on the lift machine where they lift these big bale of cotton. We would go out on the river in the summer. He would take us around, look at the animals when they came in, the elephants during the time the circus come. And we would be out there to look at the boats but we didn't go to play. My daddy wouldn't let us go out there to work.

5:37

Felix Armfield

This is when you were—

6:04

Mary Jett Preston

To see the animals.

6:06

Felix Armfield

—children?

6:07

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

6:07

Felix Armfield

Now were the animals—

6:07

Mary Jett Preston

And we'd go on the river on the boat.

6:08

Felix Armfield

—at the river?

6:10

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, when the circus animals came in.

6:12

Felix Armfield

Oh, there would be a circus that came to town.

6:14

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, and my daddy would bring us out there to look at them, the elephants and circus animals when we were little.

6:17

Felix Armfield

Now what kind of work did your mother do?

6:23

Mary Jett Preston

Well, my mother did domestic, which I did domestic go over the years myself and my daddy didn't want her to go to work. Our grade school principal at the time said she wished she would have to give mom a job, but we had too many children. There was nine of us, 10 of us all together.

6:28

Felix Armfield

Really?

6:44

Mary Jett Preston

She was really needed at home and I think that played an important part in life. Well, I didn't feel that anybody was against me because we didn't have it in our home. We had a mother and father in the home, you see? My childhood was very—I didn't worry about what was outside because I had—

6:48

Felix Armfield

You were comfortable and secure at home.

7:10

Mary Jett Preston

Comfortable at home, right.

7:10

Felix Armfield

Really? You came from a very solid and secure home. You talked a moment ago going to Ferriday and being out there with your aunties. Now who else would [indistinct 00:07:27]?

7:13

Mary Jett Preston

One of my uncles. I knew two of my uncles, my Aunt Fannie and my Aunt Delphine.

7:27

Felix Armfield

I'm listening.

7:38

Mary Jett Preston

Well, I really don't know what kind of work they did, but like I said, I was a child at the time and didn't ask too many questions. But my Uncle Henry, we would go there and as we got older, they'd give us cold beer in the home. But now teenagers, they wants to go out at night. But most of the time all these things were done at church. We had the Easter egg hunt at the church and we had lot of fun at school.

7:39

Felix Armfield

Where did you attend church?

8:16

Mary Jett Preston

Most of our time was good. Oh, First Baptist Church in Ferriday.

8:18

Felix Armfield

Okay. Did you attend the Baptist church here in New Orleans also?

8:25

Mary Jett Preston

Yes.

8:32

Felix Armfield

Okay. But that was the family church in Ferriday, First Baptist?

8:33

Mary Jett Preston

Mm-hmm.

8:36

Felix Armfield

Oh, okay. And now what church did you attend—

8:42

Mary Jett Preston

My grandmother was a midwife.

8:42

Felix Armfield

Your grandmother was a midwife?

8:42

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, I think—

8:42

Felix Armfield

Now in Ferriday?

8:42

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

8:42

Felix Armfield

Okay. Now was she just a midwife for Black women or would she do midwifery for all?

8:42

Mary Jett Preston

No, that's what I'm saying. What I remember was this big picture. They were on a round table and they would take all the pictures, but I don't have those pictures. I wish I had those pictures. I know you would be interested in that picture—

8:47

Felix Armfield

I would love to see those pictures.

9:03

Mary Jett Preston

—because that's the first thing I would look at when I would go to my grandmother house. Now I don't know where those pictures are.

9:06

Felix Armfield

Now what were the pictures of?

9:11

Mary Jett Preston

It was all the ladies that were, I guess, in the class with their white uniforms on that probably went to school with her at the time. We do have pictures because I remember that picture.

9:13

Felix Armfield

Now what was your grandmother's name?

9:26

Mary Jett Preston

I wish y'all could get that—Charity Weathers.

9:27

Felix Armfield

Charity.

9:30

Mary Jett Preston

Weathers. Y'all need to search these old homes in little rural areas.

9:31

Felix Armfield

Now what area was she a midwife? What area did she work?

9:40

Mary Jett Preston

Oh, I know we had to cross the highway, but like I'm saying, it's the school for Blacks. Now I was told that they have Catholic schools now.

9:43

Felix Armfield

Catholic?

9:54

Mary Jett Preston

But I wasn't in a Catholic school.

9:55

Felix Armfield

You were not in a Catholic school?

9:57

Mary Jett Preston

No, we were in the public schools and I expect it was the only Black school there. I never knew about high school. I wasn't told about the high school, but I know I attended the grade school.

10:00

Felix Armfield

That was in Ferriday?

10:11

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

10:11

Felix Armfield

Okay. Now you didn't attend school in Ferriday, did you?

10:11

Mary Jett Preston

Yes, I did. Fifth grade.

10:17

Felix Armfield

Oh, okay. In fifth grade, you stayed in Ferriday.

10:19

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

10:21

Felix Armfield

And then you came back to New Orleans?

10:22

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

10:23

Felix Armfield

Oh, Okay. Now why did you spend a year in Ferriday and then come back to New Orleans?

10:26

Mary Jett Preston

Well, I'm saying at that time my grandmother was sick and my aunt had just lost her daughter. Now they said she had the voice of the century and—

10:29

Felix Armfield

She had what now?

10:38

Mary Jett Preston

A voice of the century. They said that's because she attended Southern University in Scotlandville, Louisiana.

10:39

Felix Armfield

Oh, okay.

10:42

Mary Jett Preston

And she over sang or something happened to her throat but she died pretty young. Well, she was married. Her name was Willie Mae. Now, Julio Cattrell—

10:48

Felix Armfield

Willie Mae used to sing?

11:02

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

11:04

Felix Armfield

Really? What kind of music did she sing?

11:05

Mary Jett Preston

Well, like I'm saying, mostly the Negro spirituals, things like that. And that's why I was asking you, do you go back to the schools to find original music that was sung during that time?

11:07

Felix Armfield

Okay. Okay. We want to uncover that. We want—

11:21

Mary Jett Preston

And why they are changing the modern style. I don't know.

11:24

Felix Armfield

What were some of those Negro spirituals that you sang? Can you remember?

11:28

Mary Jett Preston

Oh. Well, it's so long ago. Mostly they had was a Negro National Anthem. I remember that.

11:32

Felix Armfield

Okay, you do recall the National Anthem?

11:43

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, the Negro National Anthem. What I liked about it again, we had one Christmas carol we sang really in Latin.

11:45

Felix Armfield

Really?

12:03

Mary Jett Preston

That's right.

12:03

Felix Armfield

And this was—

12:04

Mary Jett Preston

We had really good schooling.

12:04

Felix Armfield

—when you were in school [indistinct 00:12:08]?

12:06

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, in church. Yes.

12:08

Felix Armfield

Really? And you sang it in Latin?

12:09

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, and I'm thinking—

12:11

Felix Armfield

Do you remember it?

12:11

Mary Jett Preston

—they've taken out Latin. We had only high school that taught Latin because my sister went to McDonogh 35 High School. She said they were taught Latin.

12:12

Felix Armfield

Do you remember that song, what you sang in Latin?

12:25

Mary Jett Preston

Sometimes it would come back to me when I'm singing in church or something like that because I was in my choir at church, which I was sorry I didn't take. I took art in high school, which I'm sorry I didn't take it in high school. Now if I go to college with all my sickness and everything else, I'm hoping I'll be able to take vocal music because one of my church members, which he was a music teacher at Cohen High School in the neighborhood, told me that I needed voice lessons, and I would take vocal music then.

12:33

Felix Armfield

Now you said that you did the Negro spirituals. Did you sing the Negro spirituals in school or just the church?

13:10

Mary Jett Preston

No, we sung them in school. Most of the Negro spirituals were sung in church too because it was like hymns. Most of them was sung in church too.

13:17

Felix Armfield

I see. I see. And you just can't recall what some of those Negro spirituals—

13:33

Mary Jett Preston

No, I was trying to go to the library. That's why I say I wanted to go back to college because we need children to know the Negro spirituals. There's no books printed with Negro spirituals the whole while I was in school. But see, those teachers brought their individual stuff to the classroom and taught us. We was taught mixed culture all through school. It wasn't limited to just Black people because we were a Black and public school. We learned all kind of music. Our American Legion—No, not America Legion. America, the Beautiful. We had all those things in school.

13:36

Felix Armfield

You pretty much enjoyed that education—

14:32

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, right.

14:35

Felix Armfield

—that you had at that time?

14:35

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

14:36

Felix Armfield

What made that education so enjoyable?

14:37

Mary Jett Preston

We felt our teachers wanted to teach us then, and we were mixed already. We can't say we were all Black, all White, or all middle class or whatever, but our teachers were interested in us. What's happening now, my children were in high school and the teacher told me, he said, "I'm going to get paid whether your son learns or not." You see, that's the attitude they give you. Now at that time, we were happy going to school, but the children tell you now they're not happy in school.

14:42

Felix Armfield

Oh, a big difference then when you went to school is the teachers—

15:20

Mary Jett Preston

We were happy to go to school and our teachers—

15:25

Felix Armfield

—wanted to be there and teachers and they wanted you to learn. In what ways did you know that these teachers wanted you to learn? How did they let you know they wanted you to learn?

15:25

Mary Jett Preston

Because if I excelled in anything, I would go on to the next step in learning, you see? It's like at Dillard University where I told you my cousin was the president, Dr. Albert Dent. We went out there to sing when they put the chapel in school. And as my children grow up in public schools, I got to be the president or officer in the class in our PTA. Now that's another thing where people saying it's—They fussing too much at PTA meetings. They're not interested in going to PTA meeting anymore but—

15:37

Felix Armfield

Were your parents active in the PTA meetings?

16:12

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, my mother would come to school and that's why we were liking—

16:17

Felix Armfield

Your mother taught school?

16:21

Mary Jett Preston

No.

16:22

Felix Armfield

No, no. She would come to the school.

16:22

Mary Jett Preston

To the school. We had programs. My brother might have been on program and our principal would have nice—We had nice entertainment at school. We were taught dancing.

16:25

Felix Armfield

Your parents also were very active in your education?

16:38

Mary Jett Preston

Right. My daddy would teach us plenty of things at home.

16:41

Felix Armfield

Really?

16:45

Mary Jett Preston

And they asked us—

16:46

Felix Armfield

What kinds of things did your father teach you at home?

16:47

Mary Jett Preston

Well, most of the time he would taught us—I don't understand if this is Latin or numbers. They're teaching children Spanish in some of the schools, not all the schools now. [foreign language 00:17:07]. Those are numbers.

16:49

Felix Armfield

Okay, and your father would teach you those kinds of things at home.

17:07

Mary Jett Preston

And he'd teach us how to write our name.

17:10

Felix Armfield

Really?

17:11

Mary Jett Preston

Mm-hmm, because he did—

17:16

Felix Armfield

Now was your father educated?

17:17

Mary Jett Preston

He went to sixth grade.

17:19

Felix Armfield

He went to sixth grade.

17:21

Mary Jett Preston

Sixth grade was real nice. My grandmother said that when they were in the country, daddy would pay school, which was about 5 cents a week.

17:22

Felix Armfield

Really?

17:35

Mary Jett Preston

Can you understand 5 cents a week?

17:36

Felix Armfield

And that's what they charged him to go to school? He paid 5 cents and he could go to school in the country. Now is that there in Ferriday?

17:38

Mary Jett Preston

Mm-mm. They're from Pointe Coupee. That's the Pecan—

17:45

Felix Armfield

Princopee?

17:45

Mary Jett Preston

Pointe Coupee. P-O-N—See, I don't really know how to spell it. Pointe Coupee Parish. It's Plaquemine Country. Now they done found oil on the land.

17:55

Felix Armfield

Really?

18:02

Mary Jett Preston

And my daddy said during the war they took over and planted potatoes.

18:03

Felix Armfield

Oh, I'll get the spelling of that but that was for your—

18:10

Mary Jett Preston

Correct spelling.

18:13

Felix Armfield

—family was from, your father.

18:13

Mary Jett Preston

Oh yes.

18:15

Felix Armfield

Really?

18:16

Mary Jett Preston

Another story he told us, they would go skinny-dipping in the water. Their daddy had told them not to go. He didn't want him in the water anymore and what made him catch them in the water? My uncle fell on a catfish, stuck it in his hand, and then daddy took a whip and whipped everybody who was wet. It wasn't funny because he say he didn't need but one lick with the whip.

18:19

Felix Armfield

I can imagine. They were already wet.

18:50

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, I'm thinking that's what's wrong with our children now. They're not getting chastised. They're not coming up with the father in the home.

18:52

Felix Armfield

Well how were you chastised as a child?

19:01

Mary Jett Preston

Well, my dad just slapped me once or twice as a teenager. Other than that, my auntie would take a peach tree switch and whip our legs.

19:04

Felix Armfield

Peach tree switch.

19:16

Mary Jett Preston

You laughing.

19:20

Felix Armfield

It's—

19:21

Mary Jett Preston

Your mother never spank you? Your auntie never spank you?

19:22

Felix Armfield

My grandmother and my great-aunt did all the whipping in the house.

19:25

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, my great-aunt did the whipping.

19:27

Felix Armfield

My grandmother, she didn't mind wearing my fanny out.

19:30

Mary Jett Preston

And I think that's what's wrong with children now. They don't go to church. They're not enjoying life.

19:33

Felix Armfield

Really?

19:35

Mary Jett Preston

No, because—

19:35

Felix Armfield

Now what role did the church play in your growing up?

19:43

Mary Jett Preston

Really important role because my auntie, like I said, my great-aunt, was the secretary in the church. My great-grandmother was—

19:45

Felix Armfield

That was [indistinct 00:19:58].

19:56

Mary Jett Preston

—a deaconess. Yes, and she was a midwife so they were well known in the community.

19:59

Felix Armfield

You said your grandmother was a midwife. She was a midwife to who?

20:05

Mary Jett Preston

I guess everybody. Mostly all the Blacks. That's all I saw. I didn't know if she attended to the White people or not. You see that wasn't discussed. Like I'm saying, all that wasn't discussed.

20:09

Felix Armfield

Really?

20:21

Mary Jett Preston

I really don't know.

20:21

Felix Armfield

Those kinds of things—

20:22

Mary Jett Preston

That's what I'm saying, those things have to be searched if y'all going to write books or something. I don't know. I really don't know.

20:22

Felix Armfield

Do you ever recall seeing her going and coming to do her work?

20:33

Mary Jett Preston

No, because at that time when I was born, my grandmother had stopped working at that time. Her hair had turned white and that's why I say I admire people with white hair, beautiful white hair. She had gotten sick. Really, like I'm saying, I didn't come up in the time. I knew she was a midwife because of this picture that they had it in my aunt's house and I knew she was a member of the church because they had her body in the church. It was probably on a Sunday. Everybody in the community, all of them viewed her body.

20:36

Felix Armfield

Really?

21:17

Mary Jett Preston

I was there for her death.

21:19

Felix Armfield

You were telling me when we first got started talking, before we started recording, you told us—

21:24

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, which was the hurting part. My daddy said here in the city, he didn't have jobs during the depression, but he worked on the river after he was married. But he was a chef in most of the restaurants in the city, Felix Commander's Palace. He got apprentice doctors at Touro Infirmary. We were born at home, believe it or not.

21:28

Felix Armfield

You all were born at home, all 10 of the children?

21:57

Mary Jett Preston

No, not all 10 of them. My one sister was born at Flint-Goodridge. Know where Flint-Goodridge? My sister, Edith was born at Flint-Goodridge. Ronald was born and Jane was born in the country. Ronald was born here in the hospital.

22:00

Felix Armfield

Okay, but you were born at home.

22:15

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah. Most—

22:18

Felix Armfield

Are you the oldest or—

22:18

Mary Jett Preston

I'm the oldest girl.

22:19

Felix Armfield

You're the oldest girl. Really? What kind of responsibilities did that bring about as being the oldest?

22:21

Mary Jett Preston

It really brings plenty of responsibility. We were talking about it yesterday. I was around one of my grandchildren, two of my grandchildren's mother and my son. They not married. I was saying from my own experience that it look like the younger children are having more of the fun and the older children shares responsibility of the home, which why are the younger children more jealous of the elder children?

22:26

Felix Armfield

Were they jealous of you?

22:58

Mary Jett Preston

I'm thinking my baby sister is. She will take more color out for my mother. I'll take color out my dad's side of the family.

23:00

Felix Armfield

What things did you have to do being the oldest child, the oldest girl?

23:13

Mary Jett Preston

Well, I had to make groceries.

23:17

Felix Armfield

Really?

23:22

Mary Jett Preston

Do the grocery shopping. Do all the sewing.

23:22

Felix Armfield

Really?

23:27

Mary Jett Preston

Yes, and help feed my baby sister.

23:30

Felix Armfield

You were responsible—

23:36

Mary Jett Preston

And took care of my baby brother because my mother was in the hospital when he was—Didn't come out the hospital before he did.

23:36

Felix Armfield

Oh really?

23:42

Mary Jett Preston

He was brought home.

23:42

Felix Armfield

You had to take care of that baby?

23:44

Mary Jett Preston

Mm-hmm.

23:46

Felix Armfield

That almost became your baby.

23:46

Mary Jett Preston

Well, everybody do think, "Oh, that's your child." I say, "No." I say if everybody knew us, Ronny's not my—We moved here, I think, in June of 1950 in this neighborhood and my brother was born in August.

23:47

Felix Armfield

Oh, so people—

24:07

Mary Jett Preston

My mother didn't live too long after he was born.

24:09

Felix Armfield

Oh. Now is he the youngest child?

24:12

Mary Jett Preston

Yes.

24:14

Felix Armfield

Oh, you had to take care of him because your mother had died.

24:14

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

24:19

Felix Armfield

Now how old were you at the time?

24:19

Mary Jett Preston

Well, I was right out of high school. I was born '31. He said I'm 20 years older than he is.

24:22

Felix Armfield

Okay, you were about 20 at the time.

24:28

Mary Jett Preston

I was working. I was trying to work in a doctor's office at a children's clinic.

24:30

Felix Armfield

And so, did you raise your brother as if he was yours?

24:35

Mary Jett Preston

No, I didn't raise him. No, I didn't raise in. I was living at home with my daddy, my other sisters and brothers until I was married. After that, Ronald wouldn't eat and he had bad teeth. Like I'm saying, at that time, we had our elder aunts in the country, you see? He went to the country and they helped him.

24:37

Felix Armfield

He moved out to the country and stayed with them.

25:01

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, and I think that with family, aunts and uncles—See, my mother had all the children. They didn't have but maybe one or two children, my great aunts, and my aunt didn't have any children at all. My mother had all the children. We were a close family and everybody helped one another, you see?

25:03

Felix Armfield

Everybody just pitched in and helped out, especially after your mother died.

25:26

Mary Jett Preston

Yes.

25:31

Felix Armfield

They helped out with the raising of Ronald—

25:32

Mary Jett Preston

Ronald.

25:34

Felix Armfield

—it is, right?

25:34

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

25:35

Felix Armfield

Now what did your father do after your mother passed away?

25:35

Mary Jett Preston

Well, he did shoe repair work at home—

25:39

Felix Armfield

Shoe repair?

25:41

Mary Jett Preston

—after he had the broken back. It wasn't too long after we moved in our house that he had his accident on the river.

25:45

Felix Armfield

Okay. Tell me about that accident on the river.

25:51

Mary Jett Preston

Well, my daddy saved [indistinct 00:25:56]. Later on, I found out that the man—They usually hired two people. This man who was working with my daddy, he didn't notify anyone that he was going to California. But what I'm saying, why he explained to me it wasn't as if it was a regular job. If it was a regular job, which they hired people by the day, it probably wouldn't have happened, but what's going to happen is going to happen. That's why I think my daddy explained to me, because of his accident was it wasn't a job. People wasn't hired—So many people for the job. I guess whoever showed up that day was given work.

25:53

Felix Armfield

Really?

26:48

Mary Jett Preston

And this man knew he was supposed to come to work, but he took off and didn't notify the people that he was gone, you see, and didn't let my daddy know. He apologized to me about that because they say I look plenty like my daddy.

26:49

Felix Armfield

Really? You look like your father. Well, was your father compensated for the accident?

27:04

Mary Jett Preston

No, that was the problem. After we moved in the house, they told my daddy the only way they would compensate him for a settlement was he had to go through an operation, but my daddy didn't want to go through the operation because the doctor said he had 50/50 chance of living. It was a spinal cord injury and my daddy, knowing plenty about doctoring, he decided against it. Now before my daddy died, they finally operated on his back.

27:11

Felix Armfield

Really?

27:51

Mary Jett Preston

Finally did something to his back just to study it, you see, because he said the doctor explained to him that it was little fine spinal cords that were broken.

27:51

Felix Armfield

Really?

28:05

Mary Jett Preston

It wasn't a major spinal cord. If it was a major spinal cord, it would've probably kill him. He said the reason why it didn't kill him, because he saw the cotton falling and he moved. He couldn't get out his machine, but he moved, where he didn't get the complete force of it.

28:07

Felix Armfield

Yeah, I bet that was a major impact—

28:26

Mary Jett Preston

I know it was.

28:27

Felix Armfield

—of that big bale of cotton falling on someone [indistinct 00:28:34].

28:27

Mary Jett Preston

Yes, because I know they're a thousand pounds. A bale of cotton is a thousand pounds.

28:33

Felix Armfield

I bet his back never was right again.

28:37

Mary Jett Preston

No, over the years he went to Amite, Louisiana. My brother John has a house.

28:41

Felix Armfield

He went to where?

28:47

Mary Jett Preston

He had just finished his new house in Amite, Louisiana.

28:48

Felix Armfield

Amite?

28:51

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

28:52

Felix Armfield

Can you spell that for me?

28:52

Mary Jett Preston

A-M-I-T-E. I think that's right.

28:55

Felix Armfield

That's okay.

28:57

Mary Jett Preston

Anyway, he went to Amite, Louisiana and both of my little nieces ran into him and he fell because he was on braces and crutches. Now after this last fall, it hurt the hip bone, you see, and he never couldn't walk around too much after that.

28:58

Felix Armfield

Really? Did you—

29:27

Mary Jett Preston

But he lived a long time.

29:30

Felix Armfield

How old was your father when he passed?

29:32

Mary Jett Preston

Let's see. Born in 1907. He died '84. Seven from 14—

29:39

Felix Armfield

1907 to 1984. That was a long time.

29:40

Mary Jett Preston

I am counting. He was 74.

29:50

Felix Armfield

77.

29:53

Mary Jett Preston

77 when he got died.

29:53

Felix Armfield

77. That was a prosperous life. Now—

29:53

Mary Jett Preston

My auntie, she 89 now.

30:01

Felix Armfield

—were you taking care of him at the time?

30:01

Mary Jett Preston

We all was taking care of him because after I got married, I would come back home after each baby looked like—I had two children born here in New Orleans.

30:06

Felix Armfield

Okay, you had two children. Oh, I see. You were telling me before we got started with the interview about your uncle who went to the services and he got sick and something about the doctors didn't want to take care of him or something. Didn't you say you had an uncle who went to—

30:18

Mary Jett Preston

During the war?

30:36

Felix Armfield

Yes, ma'am.

30:37

Mary Jett Preston

No, he didn't get sick. I'm saying my brother was in the war too.

30:40

Felix Armfield

Oh, your brother was in the war. Okay.

30:41

Mary Jett Preston

I'm saying my uncle, when he was small—That's why my grandfather caught daddy and them skinny-dipping in the water when he got a whipping with the whip.

30:42

Felix Armfield

Okay. Well, tell me about your brother who went to the war.

30:54

Mary Jett Preston

Well, my oldest brother, he was in the Korean War and he was injured, really. He was standing guard or something and he claimed he could have been killed if it wasn't for the frozen snow in Korea. They had Guam in the paper today. Something's going on in Guam. Many men were killed during the Second World War. They don't say too much about the Korean War.

31:00

Felix Armfield

Yeah, yeah. But your brother fought—

31:28

Mary Jett Preston

My oldest brother was in the Korean War.

31:30

Felix Armfield

What was your oldest brother's name?

31:32

Mary Jett Preston

Albert

31:33

Felix Armfield

Albert.

31:33

Mary Jett Preston

Edmond. Oh, I was telling you about my brother, James. After the second World War, he was living away from home. I think that's why he came back home. I don't know if he was South Carolina or where he was but he was in the service with my husband. And—

31:35

Felix Armfield

Go ahead.

31:57

Mary Jett Preston

—after his children were born, we were together in El Paso after I was married. That how I met my husband. I think that was in South Carolina. They'll put it in this order. He said the doctor didn't want to help his son.

32:11

Felix Armfield

Now when was this?

32:24

Mary Jett Preston

Let me see. I was married in '53. That was in the 50s before integration.

32:26

Felix Armfield

Before integration.

32:31

Mary Jett Preston

And I'm thinking that's why things like that started the civil rights. People had got tired of that type of treatment.

32:36

Felix Armfield

What kinds of things—

32:46

Mary Jett Preston

I think the men suffered more from segregation than the mothers and the daughters or something like that.

32:49

Felix Armfield

In what ways do you think they suffered more?

32:54

Mary Jett Preston

Because of, like I'm saying, the jobs or maybe the ill-treatment they received from the doctors or something. They had to take them to—Because we didn't have too many Black doctors. That's one profession I know in New Orleans we didn't have many.

33:01

Felix Armfield

Really? That was a major concern.

33:16

Mary Jett Preston

That was a problem, yes.

33:19

Felix Armfield

Not only did Black people, they couldn't see all the White doctors, but you didn't have Black doctors to—

33:23

Mary Jett Preston

The White doctors had to help y'all, even though, like I'm saying, we may have Black midwives to deliver the babies. But at that time, even in the Black colleges, I don't know why they cut out midwifing. Why did they cut out teaching the nurses how to deliver babies? And I think that's one of the problems why they closed up Dillard University. What college you going to? Dillard?

33:27

Felix Armfield

No, no.

34:00

Mary Jett Preston

Where you all at? What college you all here?

34:01

Felix Armfield

We are here with SUNO, Southern University.

34:02

Mary Jett Preston

Right, that's where my people went.

34:09

Felix Armfield

Really?

34:12

Mary Jett Preston

And I want go to SUNO.

34:13

Felix Armfield

When you say your people, did your other brothers and sisters get to go to college?

34:15

Mary Jett Preston

My sister went to Xavier University. One of my sons went to—

34:21

Felix Armfield

They went to Xavier?

34:22

Mary Jett Preston

Uh-huh. I had two sisters go to Xavier, but one really graduated. And my brother went to some school in California. Ronald, he was a Marine in the Vietnam War. But I want to go to Southern because that's where my cousin went to Southern. I had a nephew go to Southern in Scotlandville. They just recently put one here in New Orleans. Are you going to the one here in New Orleans?

34:22

Felix Armfield

We're working with the one here.

34:52

Mary Jett Preston

They call in SUNO, yeah.

34:53

Felix Armfield

Yeah, we're working with—

34:54

Mary Jett Preston

Oh, well, I'm glad then.

34:55

Felix Armfield

—them here in New Orleans.

34:55

Mary Jett Preston

They say whenever they release my husband's money or whatever, the doctors want me to go to college because I had a scholarship to college when I finished high school.

35:01

Felix Armfield

Now when you say that they release your husband's money—

35:07

Mary Jett Preston

Well, it was all going through probate court, from what I understand.

35:10

Felix Armfield

You mean money because your husband served in the military—

35:16

Mary Jett Preston

Because of his death, yeah.

35:20

Felix Armfield

—and all that kind stuff?

35:20

Mary Jett Preston

And we were divorced also. It's just a lot of complicated mess.

35:21

Felix Armfield

I see. I see. What things did you experience when you went to see the doctor here in New Orleans?

35:27

Mary Jett Preston

Well, my daddy always complained that they would send my mother home now right at Charity Hospital where I'll go.

35:39

Felix Armfield

They would send your mother home?

35:52

Mary Jett Preston

Yes, they would send her home and my daddy thought she needed to be at the hospital and they would send you back home. Now that's what they're doing. I don't know why they would send you home, then they say, "Well, come back," and he would say, "I would have to come home and deliver the baby himself," you see? Now that's the problem we had at Charity, but this happened to my brother when he was in surgery.

35:55

Felix Armfield

Now this was Charity Hospital?

36:30

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, which I figure is a good hospital but they so overcrowded now, you see? That was about the only hospital in the city most of the people went to. From what I understand, the people living in this neighborhood, most of them went to Touro because they didn't take them too much at Baptist Hospital.

36:32

Felix Armfield

Touro?

36:54

Mary Jett Preston

Touro.

36:54

Felix Armfield

Touro. Which would you spell that?

36:57

Mary Jett Preston

T-O-U-R-O. I don't know if you heard about our hospital, Touro Infirmary. I think it's a Jewish hospital.

36:59

Felix Armfield

Was that the Black hospital at one time?

37:06

Mary Jett Preston

No, our only Black hospital was Flint-Goodridge run by Dillard University.

37:08

Felix Armfield

Okay, Flint-Goodridge—

37:19

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, my—

37:21

Felix Armfield

—was the Black hospital that was run by Dillard.

37:21

Mary Jett Preston

Dillard University.

37:23

Felix Armfield

Okay, was it on Dillard University's campus?

37:27

Mary Jett Preston

No, it's right uptown in this area off Louisiana.

37:28

Felix Armfield

It was in the uptown area?

37:32

Mary Jett Preston

Yes.

37:33

Felix Armfield

But it was run by Dillard?

37:33

Mary Jett Preston

Yes.

37:33

Felix Armfield

Oh, okay. Now is that where you found your Black doctors and Black nurses?

37:36

Mary Jett Preston

Yes.

37:38

Felix Armfield

Flint-Goodridge, it took care of all the Black patients here in New Orleans?

37:40

Mary Jett Preston

No, not really, because like I'm saying, all the Catholics ran—I think that's why they asked y'all to come to the Our Lady of Lourdes because the Catholics ran a lot of the hospitals, Black schools and things, private schools and things like that, you see? The Catholic Charities would—

37:44

Felix Armfield

The Catholics were running the schools and the hospitals.

38:06

Mary Jett Preston

Well, really in charge of most of the things, schools and everything for Blacks, you see.

38:08

Felix Armfield

Really? Really? Now when the Catholics ran these schools, were Black teachers in those Catholic schools or were that you had to deal with White nuns?

38:14

Mary Jett Preston

The nuns. You had to deal with the nuns mostly.

38:24

Felix Armfield

Mostly. Were there any Black nuns?

38:26

Mary Jett Preston

I didn't see any really growing up.

38:29

Felix Armfield

You didn't see any Black nuns?

38:36

Mary Jett Preston

Uh-uh, growing up. I guess we had them, but I didn't see any. Like I'm saying, when you saw a nun, they represent virtue and things like that and I think that helped me out in growing up.

38:37

Felix Armfield

When you saw the nuns, nuns were a representation of—

38:48

Mary Jett Preston

Of virtue.

38:50

Felix Armfield

—of virtue and and serenity and all that kind stuff, but—

38:53

Mary Jett Preston

Right, and it really helped.

38:57

Felix Armfield

But you didn't see any Black nuns.

38:59

Mary Jett Preston

Right.

39:02

Felix Armfield

They all were White nuns.

39:02

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

39:08

Felix Armfield

Really? Really? Now you didn't attend any of those Catholic schools though, did you?

39:08

Mary Jett Preston

No.

39:09

Felix Armfield

Okay, you went to—

39:10

Mary Jett Preston

But I would see them. They had a house on Jackson Avenue. Oh, let me see. I live on St. Tom. I would get the street car. I would pass their house and I would see her in they white habits. At that time, they would come out on the porch, I guess, sometime in they homes and that inspired me from a little girl, seeing them in their pretty white clothes.

39:12

Felix Armfield

Did you ever think about being a nun yourself?

39:42

Mary Jett Preston

Yes, I did.

39:44

Felix Armfield

Really?

39:46

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah. I really wanted to be a nun.

39:47

Felix Armfield

Really? What were their names? Can you recall some of the hospitals that the Catholic Church ran?

39:47

Mary Jett Preston

Well, I know Charity Hospital where we went was run by the nuns because they were there in their habits at that time I was growing up. They had these beautiful headdress, beautiful white, big, old headdress. After a while, I was done when they stopped them nuns from wearing their habits.

39:56

Felix Armfield

Really?

40:15

Mary Jett Preston

I think that was a part of life that they should have kept up.

40:16

Felix Armfield

You just liked those outfits?

40:18

Mary Jett Preston

They used to get on the streetcar in the summertime in their beautiful white clothes. Whoo, that was pretty. That was I think the best part of New Orleans growing up in the South. We had a lot of people representing good side of life. But you can't tell a nun from nobody else now. That's the truth. And I think integration stopped a lot of things that were very important like prayers in the schools. Even no one was blessing our food at the table. They took all that out of schools.

40:21

Felix Armfield

What—

40:55

Mary Jett Preston

Children make so much noise in school.

40:57

Felix Armfield

What things did you do in school that they don't do now?

40:59

Mary Jett Preston

Well, that's trying to tell you. They don't have prayers. The children just come in the cafeteria with all the noise and they have the parents be volunteering, which they had asked me to come volunteer. Children would just come in. Some of them wouldn't want to eat. They make so much noise coming in the cafeteria. We didn't have that in school. We didn't have children running around in the halls, smoking and all that, giving permission to smoke. When my brothers went to high school, we wore ties and we had to have ribbon or something in our hair or something like that. They don't do that no more.

41:02

Felix Armfield

Really? When you all went to school, your brothers had to wear ties every day and you had to make certain that your hair was all done up with the ribbon or something at sometime?

41:40

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, when we were little, especially in high school. We had gym clothes, which the children don't want to wear gym clothes. We had elastic in our gym clothes. I think that's why some children are skeptical about wearing the shorts because this one little girl, one of my son's godchild, she didn't want dress up. The shorts are too short. We had elastic in ours. Why they stopped those type of gym clothes?

41:47

Felix Armfield

And how far down did those shorts com?

42:25

Mary Jett Preston

Enough to cover a decent part of your leg and I think that's another thing wrong with our culture, you see? If a child was going to run and play, why have her clothes so short and you can't tell the girls clothes from the boys, you see? And I think that's why the child was afraid though, you see?

42:27

Felix Armfield

You mentioned a little while ago, and I just want to have you state it for me again just so we can clarify it and make it clear, you said that your brother, when he moved to someplace—

42:56

Mary Jett Preston

He was in the service at the time. I think he was in South Carolina.

43:05

Felix Armfield

—and they wouldn't treat his child or something. Do you remember—

43:08

Mary Jett Preston

That wasn't in segregation. All these things was happening, which I'm thinking that was during segregation because segregation didn't start till the 60s, right?

43:13

Felix Armfield

Mm-hmm.

43:28

Mary Jett Preston

Right. All right. Now they claim around '59 or the 60s, that was the hundred-year anniversary of the end of slavery. The 60s?

43:28

Felix Armfield

Yes, ma'am.

43:41

Mary Jett Preston

Well, that's what some man told me and why people were becoming uneasy about it because they wasn't getting jobs. Very few children were going to college. Our high schools didn't have—My daddy probably wanted me to go into nursing. Now when they built a new high school, especially for Blacks named after Black, all the things that they wanted in the school, it wasn't placed there, you see? If I would've wanted the opportunity to go to school for nursing or something like that, I didn't have it, but the White schools had it, you see? And that would, I think, hurt our parents more so.

43:42

Felix Armfield

The fact that—

44:27

Mary Jett Preston

We weren't raised like—Let's see. The first step of going into nursing, the young girls be in high school and they call them all—I forget the name they call them, but they have their little smocks on or something like that and it's just a volunteer service, but it's teaching them about nursing, but they didn't have it for the Black girls.

44:28

Felix Armfield

Really? What things did you have at your school?

44:57

Mary Jett Preston

Well, mostly they call it vocational school and I think that's why they're saying the children don't have enough math. They don't have enough reading material—

45:02

Felix Armfield

That was at your school?

45:16

Mary Jett Preston

—writing skills because it wasn't there. It wasn't placed there. I guess they figured, well, we didn't need to know all of that. But [indistinct 00:45:32] in later years in the 60s—Well, then my daughter, they said they had to go to college to get some of those studies because there wasn't even them including them in the senior high schools and the middle schools.

45:17

Felix Armfield

They would have to go on college to get all those advanced skills that White children were getting—

45:52

Mary Jett Preston

Already.

45:57

Felix Armfield

—in high school?

45:57

Mary Jett Preston

Right. Now you hear this child finishing college at 10, 12 years old because they had gotten all of that. They had taught them all of that.

45:58

Felix Armfield

I see. I see.

46:10

Mary Jett Preston

Now some of our teachers were able to teach, my daddy said, at eighth grade, which I'm thinking that's why we don't have math skills. We don't have writing skills that we should have because the Black teachers had to start at a young age, you see? And all I'm saying, if it wasn't for the Bible, I think many Black children wouldn't know how to read and write. Many of them I'm so surprised that they don't know how to read and write now.

46:12

Felix Armfield

Well, what role did the Bible—

46:50

Mary Jett Preston

Like I'm saying—

46:50

Felix Armfield

—have in helping you all to read and write then?

46:50

Mary Jett Preston

It helped my children because they wasn't getting it in school. They was telling me how they was cutting and fighting all the time.

46:51

Felix Armfield

For you—

46:56

Mary Jett Preston

Around the 60s, yeah.

46:56

Felix Armfield

Oh, okay. For you, what happened with—

47:02

Mary Jett Preston

Keeping my children in church and they been learning how to read the Bible, it really helped them.

47:03

Felix Armfield

Really?

47:09

Mary Jett Preston

Church should play important part in learning in anybody's life and I think that's what helped the Black people most, more than anything else.

47:10

Felix Armfield

Was church.

47:21

Mary Jett Preston

Going to church.

47:21

Felix Armfield

What do you think the church did? What was it about the church that kept people together and in place and out of those troubled things, as you said?

47:24

Mary Jett Preston

Right, because you had to rely on—My daddy always taught that all knowledge come from God and I think that's what helped us a whole lot. Like Booker T. Washington say, "Up from Slavery," you see?

47:35

Felix Armfield

Did you all read Booker T. Washington's book when you were in school?

47:58

Mary Jett Preston

I read it after I got out of high school but it was nice. My daddy said that Booker Washington went all over the world teaching people the value of an education, which they wasn't trying to give us during that time. I don't know if it happened in every state. Many children now come out the country, they wasn't given an education, but I know we had schools where I came from. They had schools where my daddy came from.

48:02

Felix Armfield

What kind of schools were they? Were they big schools like today or—

48:31

Mary Jett Preston

Well, church schools. Our schools, they were just like schools are now. Yeah.

48:35

Felix Armfield

And you had what was called church schools?

48:40

Mary Jett Preston

My grandmother said that's where my daddy went, church school.

48:44

Felix Armfield

Okay, church school. What was church school?

48:47

Mary Jett Preston

Well, we call our our church school, Sunday school, but we haven't had one yet and I think that's where we look back was for the Baptist Church concerned. We have a summer school, vocational Bible school, but as far as church teaching reading, writing, arithmetic, I'm thinking that's where our churches, as far as the Baptist churches, we didn't get that. And I'm thinking if the Baptist people had thought of just establishing in some communities the teaching the regular ABCs, we might have progressed some. Our children would know math and our children would have all that background.

48:52

Felix Armfield

Now is that what you mean by church school that your father went to?

49:42

Mary Jett Preston

Uh-huh. Our daddy got it in the contract. Some rural areas may have had it because that's what they sold on routes north and south. You look at that route in north and south?

49:49

Felix Armfield

Yes, ma'am. I sure did.

49:59

Mary Jett Preston

Well, some children got it already on the plantation or in the church schools but here in this area, I didn't see that too much even though they taught the Bible in vacation Bible school. But on a regular basis, they should have had it, you see? Some people had to hide. My daddy said during [indistinct 00:50:26]. The Black people, believe it or not, taught the White children and they couldn't teach their own Black children. See, if they had a teacher or had a Black teacher or something like that, they wasn't allowed to teach the Black children. Now that's what they daddy said. Now, I don't know.

50:06

Felix Armfield

The only thing they could do was come down and teach the White children.

50:40

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah. I didn't want to believe that, but—

50:44

Felix Armfield

It probably happened.

50:46

Mary Jett Preston

The last lady I worked for on St. Charles Avenue, she said, "Well, I know that."

50:48

Felix Armfield

Now was this a White lady?

50:55

Mary Jett Preston

Yes. That was surprising. I didn't want to believe that. We had Black teachers teach the White children, but they couldn't teach the Black children. Now I thought it was the other way around.

50:56

Felix Armfield

And the White lady that you worked for on St. Charles Street—

51:09

Mary Jett Preston

Said she was a teacher and she said she knew that they had Black teachers teaching the White children—

51:12

Felix Armfield

Really?

51:20

Mary Jett Preston

—when they couldn't teach the Black children. In other words, that's another form of segregation, which was ignorant, I think. Well, daddy said all down through our generation were doctors and teachers. I want to go into elementary education.

51:20

Felix Armfield

Now you're saying within your family, there have been doctors and teachers, huh?

51:42

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, and midwives. All those important thing, I think, of children not knowing things—I'll be surprised when people tell me they don't know how to read and write.

51:47

Felix Armfield

Really? Really? Obviously reading and writing was very important to your education when you went to school.

52:01

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

52:10

Felix Armfield

You all had to do the reading and writing?

52:10

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

52:13

Felix Armfield

Really?

52:13

Mary Jett Preston

And we were able to teach at home.

52:13

Felix Armfield

What now?

52:13

Mary Jett Preston

My daddy was able to teach us at home, which parents, I think, that helps too. See, with one parent home, children didn't get all of that. During slavery time, I don't think they were be able to do it anyway but as people got to the place where the fathers was able to stay with their children, then some parents were able to teach the children at home and that's what I stress a whole lot. Teach our children at home.

52:19

Felix Armfield

Now did your mother do anything outside of the house other than domestic work?

52:51

Mary Jett Preston

No.

52:56

Felix Armfield

Okay. She did pull—

52:56

Mary Jett Preston

She was plenty ironing. My mother did plenty of ironing and cooking. Our people were cooks too. Good cooks. Did the cooking. Did all the cooking, bread making and all that.

53:00

Felix Armfield

Really?

53:13

Mary Jett Preston

Washing. We used a smoothing iron. You ever seen a smoothing iron?

53:13

Felix Armfield

What is that?

53:13

Mary Jett Preston

Oh boy.

53:21

Felix Armfield

Tell me about it.

53:22

Mary Jett Preston

Well, you take a little grate. We had running water. We had the outhouse in the country. We had a citrine with the rainwater. But here in the city, believe it or not, you put coals—You had a smoothing iron. The men would make an ironing board. That's why I was saying I wish you could visit some homes where people are still using these ironing boards and you cover it with a sheet. You wrap it up. The men would cut a piece of wood to make an ironing board. You put it on two chairs or whatever. You hold it up. I guess that had to go out style. We didn't have gas and electricity. We had lamps, a kerosene lamp. Do you know about the kerosene lamp?

53:23

Felix Armfield

I've seen one, but I can't say that I—

54:17

Mary Jett Preston

Y'all didn't ever use them in North and South Carolina?

54:18

Felix Armfield

My grandparents can tell you all about them.

54:22

Mary Jett Preston

Your grandparents had it?

54:24

Felix Armfield

They can tell you all about the kerosene lamps and my father may be able to tell you something, but I can't. When I came along, there was electricity.

54:25

Mary Jett Preston

Oh, well, it was electricity too in parts of the city, but I'm saying in some parts of the city, people didn't have electricity in every house. We didn't have gas in every house.

54:32

Felix Armfield

Really?

54:43

Mary Jett Preston

My daddy got the radio. As I got to be a teenager, we got the telephone. It was $5 then to put in the telephone in your house.

54:45

Felix Armfield

Oh really?

54:55

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah. And—

54:55

Felix Armfield

$5 to put the telephone in? This was probably in the 40s and 50s?

54:55

Mary Jett Preston

Yes, 30s, 40s.

54:56

Felix Armfield

Now you were telling me about the smoothing iron.

54:56

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah. Well, I'm trying to explain where you would heat. They had a little grate. You put coals in it, charcoal in it, and you light it. Well, you put kerosene oil on it. You light it and your mama had to heat the iron on there.

54:59

Felix Armfield

Okay, she heated the iron. From the heat from those coals.

55:20

Mary Jett Preston

Heated the iron. Yeah.

55:23

Felix Armfield

And she sat it on that grate?

55:24

Mary Jett Preston

Yes, and you put starch in your clothes. You starched your clothes. It was all cotton things then. We didn't have all this polyester.

55:26

Felix Armfield

And that's how she ironed?

55:35

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, they would iron your sheets.

55:35

Felix Armfield

[indistinct 00:55:41]?

55:35

Mary Jett Preston

—pillowcases. No. And we had a wood stove.

55:43

Felix Armfield

Now tell me about the wood stoves.

55:46

Mary Jett Preston

Well, you probably get up in the morning. You light the stove. Daddy would have to be to work about 4:00 in the morning. Light the stove, you had your breakfast. You cooked all your food. It was good.

55:48

Felix Armfield

Really?

56:05

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

56:05

Felix Armfield

You did all—

56:05

Mary Jett Preston

Good ole time.

56:05

Felix Armfield

—of it on the wood stove?

56:05

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

56:06

Felix Armfield

There was no electricity or gas.

56:06

Mary Jett Preston

Well, we got the electricity for the radio from the lady the next door, you see? My daddy would pay her to use electricity for the radio.

56:09

Felix Armfield

You'd just run a cord from her place and you all would listen to the radio.

56:17

Mary Jett Preston

The radio, right. My grandfather used to like to listen to the baseball game or to the fights. Joe Louis was a heavyweight champion at that time.

56:21

Felix Armfield

Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Oh yeah.

56:29

Mary Jett Preston

And daddy would want to stop us from listening to the radio. I would try to sneak and listen to it. But the most thing I remember about the soap operas are Stella Dallas during that time in the summer when I would be home in the summer and the Ave Maria.

56:32

Felix Armfield

The what now?

56:51

Mary Jett Preston

Ave Maria. You like that hymn?

56:53

Felix Armfield

How—

56:54

Mary Jett Preston

And that's another thing they don't put on the radio too much, hymns.

56:57

Felix Armfield

Okay. Okay. And what was it again? What was that hymn?

57:01

Mary Jett Preston

The Ave Maria.

57:04

Felix Armfield

Awa Maria.

57:04

Mary Jett Preston

Ave Maria.

57:06

Felix Armfield

I—

57:07

Mary Jett Preston

A-V-A-M-A-R-I-E. That's a Catholic hymn and it was beautiful, I'm thinking.

57:09

Felix Armfield

A-V—

57:17

Mary Jett Preston

A-M-A-R-I-A. I think that's the correct spelling. I'm not Catholic but like I said, we grew up in the Catholic—

57:19

Felix Armfield

Via Maria.

57:26

Mary Jett Preston

Ave Maria. You never heard of that hymn?

57:27

Felix Armfield

No, ma'am.

57:29

Mary Jett Preston

Well, I guess you all weren't around Catholics, huh?

57:32

Felix Armfield

No, I didn't grow up with Catholics.

57:35

Mary Jett Preston

Nah, you didn't grow up with Catholic. The Catholics play a predominant role here in Louisiana because they said the Catholics were—The city was settled by priests. Remember that? New Orleans was settled by priests.

57:36

Felix Armfield

Yeah.

57:51

Mary Jett Preston

They played a predominant role in all our lives.

57:52

Felix Armfield

It was the Via Maria.

57:56

Mary Jett Preston

Ave Maria. I don't know if it's French or Spanish or what but it's beautiful. I love that hymn. You hear it on the radio in the summertime and I remember that about my summers coming up—

57:57

Felix Armfield

Oh really?

58:12

Mary Jett Preston

—in Irish Channel.

58:12

Felix Armfield

Oh, that was a hymn you could hear over the radio.

58:14

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, and the soap operas.

58:16

Felix Armfield

What language was it in?

58:20

Mary Jett Preston

That's what I'm saying. I don't know if it's Catholic, Spanish or French or whatever. They call themselves teaching us French in senior high school but it wasn't much French we was getting. They're teaching children the foreign language now. It's a required subject now. They're teaching them the foreign language, how to speak in a foreign language.

58:22

Felix Armfield

I see. I see. I see.

58:47

Mary Jett Preston

What else I was telling you about? You remember it though?

58:55

Felix Armfield

No, you tell me.

59:00

Mary Jett Preston

You remember about what I was saying about my brother? Oh, what I wanted to discuss was my brother was telling me during the 50s, that's when people were getting discouraged, especially after the Second World War and the people that fought in the Second World War. We didn't feel prejudice until around the 50s and 60s in some states.

59:01

Felix Armfield

You're saying once the soldiers had fought that Second World War—

59:30

Mary Jett Preston

They figured, yes—

59:33

Felix Armfield

—they came back home—

59:33

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah, they should—

59:33

Felix Armfield

—and that's when things started happening.

59:33

Mary Jett Preston

Oh yeah.

59:33

Felix Armfield

What do you think did that?

59:33

Mary Jett Preston

I don't know what caused it. I think they had gotten to the place that they had served all these world wars and they couldn't—Like I saying, it was hard for them to get to work a decent job. Well, my brother went into the service. He was working in a bakery. And right now, my son was in the service. He only get temporary work. And so I heard on the radio too, this lady was saying, well, most of the White people went to decent schools, colleges. Well, we weren't allowed to go. Like I'm saying, we didn't see all these prejudice things till after the war, after we got grown, and people just had got tired of it, I guess.

59:45

Felix Armfield

When you say you weren't allowed to go, where was it you weren't allowed to go?

1:00:24

Mary Jett Preston

Like I'm saying, we had schools, but it just was vocational schools. You wasn't really learning something that was going to give you a salary. Only thing you could do was domestic work. Even though I worked in the doctor's office, you know how much money I made a day? $3 a day.

1:00:30

Felix Armfield

And when was this?

1:00:48

Mary Jett Preston

1950. In the 50s.

1:00:49

Felix Armfield

Eight hours a day in the doctor's office. What things were you doing in the doctor's office?

1:00:49

Mary Jett Preston

Regular private nurse student.

1:00:49

Felix Armfield

Oh really?

1:00:49

Mary Jett Preston

I wasn't just cleaning up, but they call us maids, you see? Every job a Black woman did, you was a maid or domestic worker, or every job a Black man did, what you would call a day laborer. They're still calling you day laborers. You fill out insurance. You go take out insurance policy. That's all that people want to put down there. Day labor. They I don't care what kind of work you do.

1:01:01

Felix Armfield

But if you were a Black man, they would—

1:01:27

Mary Jett Preston

Or a Black person, that's right. You ain't called nothing but a day laborer. I don't care what type of work you do. And my nephew was just saying—My son trying to be a plumber, get a plumbers license. And right today, very few Blacks are in any profession that either went to college or he done got a real certified paper. That's all they want to give you, a little certification but to say you have a license, plumbers job, and it's hard. My son look on the TV, he say, "Mom, ain't no Black people on the TV." I say, "Frederick, we may have one or two Black models." Just like my sister went to school with this Ms. Bernard, she had to go overseas to Germany to get into the Met. Now, we—

1:01:31

Felix Armfield

To get into what now?

1:02:32

Mary Jett Preston

Music. Marian Anderson could say—Well, she got her training here in the United States. Even if it was one person, they figured ain't but one token Black, well, they done their job and that's wrong.

1:02:34

Felix Armfield

And there was all other Blacks out there who wanted the same opportunity.

1:02:51

Mary Jett Preston

You couldn't get it because we done picked this one Black woman to sing, see?

1:02:55

Felix Armfield

We don't want the rest of you all to sing.

1:03:00

Mary Jett Preston

We don't need the rest of y'all, but what about us with this generation? What about our generation, you see? If I wanted to be a nurse, I wanted to go into vocal music, well it's something I might have said, "Well, maybe my parents can't afford it." Well, it's not the idea your parents couldn't afford it at that time. You just wasn't allowed to you sing at your school. They had no schools open for you.

1:03:06

Felix Armfield

Yep, now we were talking about—What were you telling about when we got interrupted?

1:03:31

Mary Jett Preston

We were talking about the conflict that started with segregation, why they felt it had to end during that time after the war. Before the war, people accepted it, but it came to the place where my older brother got into the post office. But my second-oldest brother, he could have stayed out the army. They had to spend 20 or 30 years in the service at that time and that's when not just the Black people were feeling disgusted about it. I guess the White doctors were too. They figured you had no Black policemen. You had no Black firemen. You had no Black doctors.

1:03:40

Mary Jett Preston

And those people were brothers doing the work, right? Why feel you had to go overseas and kill all of these people because of hate and they were destroying other people that were from different ethnic backgrounds? Why come home where we supposed to be free and learn how live with one another, you still have that conflict at home? I think that's why all this segregation had to end. People weren't happy with it.

1:04:34

Speaker 1

In the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. [indistinct 01:05:18]. Today, we want to thank [indistinct 01:05:22] and we want to ask you to please bless us oh Lord [indistinct 01:05:38] which we are about to receive from your bounty, through Christ our Lord, Amen.

1:05:06

Felix Armfield

What's your—

1:05:37

Speaker 1

In the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. Amen.

1:05:37

Felix Armfield

Is there anything else you want to tell me? I realize you're getting ready for your lunch here at the center, but anything else you want to talk about?

1:05:37

Mary Jett Preston

That's all I remember. I'm sorry I don't have the pictures. I don't know who have the pictures. I think my niece has those pictures.

1:05:46

Felix Armfield

Well, you can just talk with your niece and if you—

1:05:55

Mary Jett Preston

And that going to be a hard thing to get those pictures.

1:05:55

Felix Armfield

Well, you talk with her and I'll leave my name and number where you can reach me if she wants to share the pictures with—

1:05:58

Mary Jett Preston

Well, I could call and tell her on the telephone and I'll ask her about this special picture, but I haven't seen that picture since I was a little girl—

1:06:03

Felix Armfield

I'd love to see that picture.

1:06:13

Mary Jett Preston

—and when my auntie died, I wasn't at home. I didn't go to the funeral, but my children went to the funeral and the burial and those homes—I haven't been to the country in, believe it or not, 39 years.

1:06:14

Felix Armfield

Really?

1:06:31

Mary Jett Preston

I passed through there when my oldest son was gone and I haven't been back, believe it or not.

1:06:31

Felix Armfield

Okay. Okay, then. Well, it's been a good interview. I've enjoyed talking with you.

1:06:39

Mary Jett Preston

I'm going to ask about this particular picture. If I could get it, I will share it with you. I'd love to share to share it with you—

1:06:44

Felix Armfield

I'd love to see that picture.

1:06:49

Mary Jett Preston

—and that'd be a nice thing for a history book.

1:06:52

Felix Armfield

Yeah, I can imagine it's a beautiful picture. I'd love to get it and get a copy of it. That's what we want—

1:06:53

Mary Jett Preston

Many people are saying they don't have pictures of their people, their parents, and—

1:07:00

Felix Armfield

Do you have pictures of your parents?

1:07:05

Mary Jett Preston

My grandmothers, I do.

1:07:06

Felix Armfield

You do have—

1:07:09

Mary Jett Preston

We got pictures of my mother. I got pictures of my father. But you want pictures of the way people lived in those days, right?

1:07:10

Felix Armfield

Well, I'd love to see the pictures of your family too.

1:07:20

Mary Jett Preston

Well, that's one we have of my family.

1:07:21

Felix Armfield

I'd love to see them too. You get ahold of them—

1:07:23

Mary Jett Preston

If I can.

1:07:25

Felix Armfield

—and I'll give you my name and number and you can just call—

1:07:26

Mary Jett Preston

All right, I'll call you.

1:07:29

Felix Armfield

—me and let me know when you've got it and I'd love to come out and take a look. Is that okay?

1:07:29

Mary Jett Preston

Mm-hmm.

1:07:34

Felix Armfield

You can write it right on the back of that brochure. Okay. Is there anything else you want to tell me about or you can think of?

1:07:38

Mary Jett Preston

Nope.

1:07:43

Felix Armfield

Nothing else, huh? You've talked enough.

1:07:43

Mary Jett Preston

I've run out.

1:07:45

Felix Armfield

Mrs. Preston, you have been a joy to talk with.

1:07:50

Mary Jett Preston

I know plenty people have more information than I do.

1:07:56

Felix Armfield

Oh, nobody has no more information than you.

1:08:02

Mary Jett Preston

But that's my information of growing up in the city and the little rural areas, which I wish I could have seen more of it because one lady saying they had gotten married at 14 in the country. He said that's all we would do. That's all they knew how to do.

1:08:03

Felix Armfield

Was getting married in those days?

1:08:22

Mary Jett Preston

Have children. Yeah.

1:08:25

Felix Armfield

Well—

1:08:28

Mary Jett Preston

But it's coming back again because it's bad, that it's—I'm saying we regressing instead of progressing. But you find that not just the Black children, just the teenagers in general want children. They only children themselves. They come from broken homes, one parent home.

1:08:29

Felix Armfield

And that just wasn't the case when you—

1:08:58

Mary Jett Preston

That wasn't the case when I grew up but it's a case now with the children, with my children too, and it's really a problem.

1:09:02

Felix Armfield

Yeah. Yeah. Well, thanks so much for your time, Ms. Preston. It's been a good interview and I'm sure we're going to have for many, many years to come and history can now record you. Are you pleased about that?

1:09:11

Mary Jett Preston

Yeah.

1:09:25

Felix Armfield

Okay. Well, thank you.

1:09:25

Mary Preston interview recording, 1994 June 21

Transcript

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1. Mary Preston administrative file, 1994

John Hope Franklin Research Center

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Mary Preston interview recording, 1994 June 21

Transcript

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John Hope Franklin Research Center

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