Alfred Smith interview recording, 1994 August 02

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Felix Armfield	Today is August 2, 1994. I'm Felix Armfield, the interviewer, and I'm about to interview Mr. Alfred James Smith at 522 Weeks Street in New Iberia, Louisiana. Mr. Smith, would you state your full name for the record, please?	0:04
Alfred James Smith	My name is Alfred James Smith.	0:25
Felix Armfield	Okay. Mr. Smith, how long have you lived here in New Iberia?	0:28
Alfred James Smith	Well, this is my home. I was born and bred here, went to school through the high school years and—	0:32
Felix Armfield	You actually finished high school?	0:46
Alfred James Smith	Yes, I finished high school.	0:48
Felix Armfield	In what year did you finish high school?	0:49
Alfred James Smith	Oh, God. I don't remember right now.	0:55
Felix Armfield	You don't remember exactly the year you finished high school?	0:56
Alfred James Smith	No.	0:59
Felix Armfield	When were you born?	1:00
Alfred James Smith	January the 29th, 1907.	1:01
Felix Armfield	January the 29th?	1:09
Alfred James Smith	29th, 1907.	1:09
Felix Armfield	1907?	1:09
Alfred James Smith	Uh-huh. In my elementary years, I attended private school. There's two sisters. Their mother had a private school called Miss Daisy Robertson's—	1:13
Felix Armfield	Miss Daisy Robertson's.	1:23
Alfred James Smith	—Private School.	1:25
Felix Armfield	Robertson?	1:29
Alfred James Smith	Yeah.	1:30
Felix Armfield	Okay.	1:33
Alfred James Smith	And from there, I went to Howe Institute.	1:34
Felix Armfield	Howe?	1:36
Alfred James Smith	Uh-huh. That is a—	1:36
Felix Armfield	Now, what was that? Howe Institute?	1:37
Alfred James Smith	That was a school run by the Baptist associations of the state.	1:42
Felix Armfield	Okay. Was your family Baptist or Catholic?	1:53
Alfred James Smith	No, they were Baptist.	1:55
Felix Armfield	You were Baptist. Okay.	1:56
Alfred James Smith	That school was located where the courthouse is over here.	2:00
Felix Armfield	Where the old courthouse building is now?	2:05
Alfred James Smith	No. Well, we don't call it the old courthouse building because that is built over the last 20 years. It's right over here on the railroad track at Madison Avenue.	2:07
Felix Armfield	Okay. I know—	2:18
Alfred James Smith	That is the grounds, those grounds and where that building is. That where Howe Institute was.	2:20
Felix Armfield	Now, Howe Institute, that was a Black education?	2:24
Alfred James Smith	That's a Black educational school run by the Baptists. The Baptist Ministers' Association had a lot to do with it.	2:26
Felix Armfield	And what grades were at Howe Institute?	2:35
Alfred James Smith	What grades?	2:37
Felix Armfield	Yes, sir.	2:38
Alfred James Smith	Let me see now. I think we graduated at ninth grade, I think, if I remember correctly. Yeah, ninth grade.	2:40
Felix Armfield	It went up to the ninth grade?	2:51
Alfred James Smith	Up to the ninth grade, yeah.	2:56
Felix Armfield	Once you finished at Howe Institute in the ninth grade, where did you go on to?	2:57
Alfred James Smith	I went to Straight College in New Orleans.	3:02
Felix Armfield	That's where you finished high school?	3:04
Alfred James Smith	I finished 12th grade there and two years of college there.	3:06
Felix Armfield	Okay. So you attended Howe Institute up to the ninth grade?	3:09
Alfred James Smith	That's right.	3:22
Felix Armfield	Then after you completed the ninth grade—	3:22
Alfred James Smith	I went to New Orleans—	3:24
Felix Armfield	New Orleans.	3:25
Alfred James Smith	—to school, and the—	3:26
Felix Armfield	Did the family send you to New Orleans?	3:26
Alfred James Smith	Beg pardon?	3:27
Felix Armfield	Your family sent you to New Orleans-	3:28
Alfred James Smith	Oh yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.	3:29
Felix Armfield	—for to continue your education.	3:36
Alfred James Smith	That's right.	3:37
Felix Armfield	Specifically, to continue your education?	3:38
Alfred James Smith	That's right. Ninth, 10th, 11th, and 12th grade.	3:38
Felix Armfield	10th, 11th, and 12th grade, and that's what you did at what was called Straight College?	3:44
Alfred James Smith	Yes.	3:47
Felix Armfield	Like a normal school?	3:48
Alfred James Smith	It was a normal school. They had freshman college, sophomore, junior college also there. But I was in high school department there.	3:49
Felix Armfield	Now, when did you finish up those high school years at Straight?	4:07
Alfred James Smith	Oh, God. I don't know. My memory's kind of bad.	4:12
Felix Armfield	Okay.	4:15
Alfred James Smith	Frankly, I've forgotten. I'm having trouble with my memory now.	4:20
Felix Armfield	That's okay. That's okay. Now, once you finished, you did finish your high school years at Straight College?	4:25
Alfred James Smith	That's right.	4:34
Felix Armfield	You went on for two more years of college?	4:35
Alfred James Smith	Right.	4:38
Felix Armfield	At Straight College?	4:38
Alfred James Smith	Right.	4:39
Felix Armfield	Okay. What was it like there at Straight College at that time?	4:39
Alfred James Smith	Well, as you know, it was an a AMA School, American Missionary Association school. It is very nice. I enjoyed it. I had no problems there at all. Teachers were all good. I lived in the boarding department there. They had a men's dormitory and a ladies' dormitory.	4:45
Felix Armfield	And this—	5:16
Alfred James Smith	That is located on Canal Street, Canal and Rocheblave.	5:17
Felix Armfield	Okay. And this around the 1920s?	5:21
Alfred James Smith	Let me see now.	5:26
Felix Armfield	Somewhere in the 1920s?	5:27
Alfred James Smith	Yeah, 1920, let me see. Let me see. Yeah, around '20, '21, '22, somewhere along in that area there as far as I can remember.	5:30
Felix Armfield	Now, how did you manage to get to New Orleans? Your family afforded you financially?	5:45
Alfred James Smith	Oh, yeah. Yeah.	5:51
Felix Armfield	Now, what did your parents do here in New Iberia, Mr. Smith?	5:52
Alfred James Smith	My father and mother lived in Orange, Texas.	5:57
Felix Armfield	In Orange, Texas.	6:01
Alfred James Smith	But I spent most of my time here in New Iberia with my grandmother. My grandmother part raised me. I'd go back and forth, but most of my schooling was done in Louisiana here. I think I went to school two years in Orange, Texas, fifth and sixth grade, if I can remember correctly.	6:02
Felix Armfield	But for the most part, you were here?	6:24
Alfred James Smith	It was here in Louisiana.	6:25
Felix Armfield	In Louisiana?	6:27
Alfred James Smith	Right here New Iberia.	6:27
Felix Armfield	With your grandmother?	6:28
Alfred James Smith	That's right, my—	6:28
Felix Armfield	What did your grandmother do for a living?	6:32
Alfred James Smith	She was just a housewife. She didn't work out nowhere.	6:33
Felix Armfield	Okay. She—	6:37
Alfred James Smith	Sometimes she had certain White families here, a couple of doctor's families she would do laundry at home for. They'd like for her to do their white shirts, and she could turn out —They was wearing those stiff collars at the time. I don't think you know nothing about that. But she could turn them out same as the Chinamen. So she had one or two doctors here that she used to do work at home for that.	6:37
Felix Armfield	Take in laundry?	7:08
Alfred James Smith	Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just one or two. Not no large amount. Just one or two doctors.	7:11
Felix Armfield	I see. I see.	7:14
Alfred James Smith	But she never worked out nowhere.	7:15
Felix Armfield	Okay.	7:16
Alfred James Smith	Now, my—	7:18
Felix Armfield	Were there other children in the home with your grandmother and you?	7:18
Alfred James Smith	No. I only had one brother. I am about eight years older than him, and he always stayed in Orange, Texas, with my mother. He would come down. But I spent most of my time here in New Iberia buried with my grandmother because I had a lot of friends in the neighborhood and thing that I —I never did like Texas. I never did like Orange, Texas. I went to school there though about two years, but I didn't care for it.	7:21
Felix Armfield	But you were pretty much sold on being with your grandmother?	7:51
Alfred James Smith	That's right. We had a large place to —Their house is still there on Field Street, 427 Field Street.	7:53
Felix Armfield	At 427 Field Street?	7:58
Alfred James Smith	That's right.	8:01
Felix Armfield	Okay.	8:06
Alfred James Smith	We had a lot of fruit trees on the place there, and my grandmother canned a lot of stuff. We lived good, and I had a lot of friends. Also, my playmates and friends were here in New Iberia around this area. I never did like Orange, Texas, much.	8:06
Felix Armfield	I see. I see.	8:24
Alfred James Smith	My reason for not liking it, when I first went to Orange, my father went to Orange and started working there. When me and my mother went to Orange, I remember I was there about, oh, less than a year. It was a bad place for Black people, that Orange, Texas.	8:25
Felix Armfield	In Orange, Texas?	8:51
Alfred James Smith	Yeah.	8:52
Felix Armfield	What made it bad for Black people?	8:54
Alfred James Smith	Well, the first thing that greeted me that I remember that really stuck in my mind was a Black man hung by his neck on one of the streets in Orange. It's very hard on Black people there. There were times the train go through there in the Jim Crow car. They'd throw bricks, knock their glasses out, shoot in the car, something in the car that a way. It was a real rough place for Blacks at that time.	8:55
Felix Armfield	Was your grandmother a real churchwoman? Religious?	9:44
Alfred James Smith	Well, she wasn't overzealous in that. She'd go to church and [indistinct 00:09:52], but she wasn't a fanatic with that. But she belonged to the Eastern Star Lodge.	9:48
Felix Armfield	Okay.	9:58
Alfred James Smith	And my—	10:00
Felix Armfield	What was the Eastern Star Lodge?	10:00
Alfred James Smith	Well, that's a women's branch of the Masonic.	10:03
Felix Armfield	Okay.	10:05
Alfred James Smith	Masonic. My grandfather was a Mason.	10:07
Felix Armfield	Grandfather was a Mason.	10:09
Alfred James Smith	And my daddy was Mason. My grandmother was Eastern Star. That's the women branch of the Masonic Lodge. She was treasurer of that for years.	10:10
Felix Armfield	What kinds of things are your earliest memories of your community and your neighborhood here in New Iberia in those years?	10:47
Alfred James Smith	The community was good. Back at that time, it is what you call now integrated because they had White families living in the block with us and behind the street behind us and thing of the kind. They all got along very well together, better than they do now, in my opinion. Because I had infantile paralysis when I was five years old. We had White neighbors in the next block from us and on the side street from us.	10:58
Alfred James Smith	Incidentally, I was born and grew up at 427 Field Street. That house is still standing, my grandmother's place, at 427 Field Street. When you had sickness in the family, anything of the kind, the White people came in and helped and were very neighborly. They got along better then, I think, in a way, in a neighborly fashion than what they do now, with the exception of probably certain cases.	11:38
Felix Armfield	In essence, your childhood neighborhood was rather integrated?	12:11
Alfred James Smith	Oh, yeah. It is mixed. Yeah. It is mixed. The Blacks were in the majority, but we had a few family within a half a block of us and so on, that a way. They all got along together. If one family had sickness or something of the kind because hospitals, I don't know if they had none. During that time, there was no hospital here in New Iberia. You had to go to New Orleans.	12:15
Felix Armfield	All the way to New Orleans?	12:40
Alfred James Smith	That's right.	12:43
Felix Armfield	Not even in Lafayette?	12:44
Alfred James Smith	Not to my knowledge. I don't remember nobody. That I don't know. But anybody who had to be hospitalized back at that time, they went to New Orleans.	12:47
Felix Armfield	Now, how is it that you got to be so fortunate to live with your grandparents?	13:07
Alfred James Smith	Well, I always would rather be with my grandparents than with my father and mother for the simple reason—	13:13
Felix Armfield	Were you born here in New Iberia?	13:21
Alfred James Smith	I was born here in New Iberia, see.	13:22
Felix Armfield	And your parents left, and then—	13:23
Alfred James Smith	Yeah. Later on, my daddy moved to Orange, Texas. I didn't like Texas at all because most of my playmates and friends and things were here in New Iberia. I was very fond of my grandfather and my grandmother. My grandfather worked in the woods in the swamp most of the time.	13:25
Felix Armfield	Now, what did he do out there?	13:47
Alfred James Smith	Well, he trapped and hunt and trees. Here on Main Street, as you go on Main Street, going east on Main Street, all those large oak trees and things, you see all those old houses there. We used to have storms here sort of regular in September. Well, most of those White people there would wait for Uncle Jimmy. That's what they called my grandfather.	13:49
Felix Armfield	Uncle Jimmy?	14:21
Alfred James Smith	He would always cut those trees, top them. Nobody could touch those trees and top them but him because the limbs were all over those old houses, mansions and things downtown. They wouldn't trust nobody to do that but him. He'd come in town. We used to have storms here regularly in September and around August the 15th, he would be busy. They'd have him busy trimming, cutting limbs off of trees or cutting down trees that would threaten their residence.	14:25
Felix Armfield	Preparing for the storm?	14:53
Alfred James Smith	That's right. He was noted for that. All those old mansions you see down Main Street going east.	14:54
Felix Armfield	As a youngster, would you tag along?	14:59
Alfred James Smith	A lot of time, yeah. He'd be working down there, and I'd go down there to take his dinner or his lunch in a bucket. I remember one incident. The house was high off the ground, and it's September. Because you used to have storms here the latter part of September and everybody wanted their trees trimmed. Any limbs that's threatening the house, they wanted them cut off and things then.	15:01
Alfred James Smith	I went to take my grandfather's dinner to him. It was a high house off the ground. It started drizzling rain, getting cool, and the White lady came out and said, "Jimmy." My grandfather's name James. They called him Jimmy. "Jimmy, you and that boy, get out of that rain. There's drizzling rain out there, and the weather's turning cool. You'll catch your death of cold there." It's a high house. "Get under the house with Rover. He ain't going to bother y'all." Not come in the house or get on the porch, but go under the house with Rover.	15:29
Felix Armfield	Now, who's Rover?	16:08
Alfred James Smith	That's the dog.	16:09
Felix Armfield	Didn't that something?	16:11
Alfred James Smith	"Go under the house with Rover." One of these high houses off the ground, we sat out under there till the showers left, but—	16:19
Felix Armfield	But you certainly were not even asked to come and sit on the porch or—	16:24
Alfred James Smith	No, no, no, no, no, no.	16:28
Felix Armfield	—needless to say, you weren't asked to come inside?	16:30
Alfred James Smith	No, no, no, no. In most cases, a lot of times you'd go in on the porch or go in the kitchen because they had Colored servants, cooks and things in the kitchen. Go in the kitchen, they'd fix a big plate of food for you. But this particular incident stuck in my mind. "Jimmy, you and that boy get out of that rain. You going to catch your death of cold. Get under the house with Rover." This house was high off the ground. Rover was a big ideal dog.	16:34
Felix Armfield	Was the dog bothered?	17:00
Alfred James Smith	No. No. Uh-uh. No. The dog didn't bark. He didn't bother.	17:01
Felix Armfield	What?	17:02
Alfred James Smith	But—	17:02
Felix Armfield	Go ahead. So I assume you ran into those kinds of situations?	17:13
Alfred James Smith	Yeah. But on the whole, the Blacks and the Whites got along better with less friction than they do now because right here, this house here, Ms. Simon and her family live here. She grew up here at this house, and there's White people across the street was there. White people lived down the street. One thing about them, they didn't utilize hospitals like they do now.	17:16
Alfred James Smith	If there was sickness or something in the house, the Whites would come in and help with the sick patients, sit up with them all night. There was more cooperation then, I think, and better comradeship than what it is now.	17:54
Felix Armfield	So basically, the community took on the healthcare concerns?	18:15
Alfred James Smith	Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. They helped each other. One had sickness, they all pitched in and helped, White and Black.	18:21
Felix Armfield	When you finally do leave the area to go on to New Orleans and you're fairly young when you go to New Orleans, I would say. You're about 15, 16?	18:43
Alfred James Smith	Yeah. Along in that bracket. I disremember now, but—	18:58
Felix Armfield	What are your initial impressions of New Orleans when you get there at that young age?	19:07
Alfred James Smith	At that young age?	19:12
Felix Armfield	Yes.	19:12
Alfred James Smith	Well, that is my first time going there. I was really excited about it because New Orleans is a really exciting place and the Carnival parades and all that kind of stuff, big city, streetcars, and that situation. Now, here in New Iberia, they had a trolley car that ran from New Iberia to Jeanerette. Jeanerette is about 12 miles east from here. I was talking in the courthouse with a couple of young lawyers, and I was telling them about the trolley car.	19:13
Alfred James Smith	The trolley car made about three trips a day to Jeanerette, which is about 12 miles from here. Usually, three or four times a week, the trolley car would wreck, run off the track because [indistinct 00:20:06].	19:55
Felix Armfield	Really?	20:05
Alfred James Smith	One of the lawyers, he said, "I heard my grandpa say the same thing." That trolley line didn't survive very long because I went to Texas and I come back, then they had took it up. It used to run on Main Street from New Iberia to Jeanerette, which is just about 12 miles	20:06
Felix Armfield	Now, again, when you were in New Orleans, after you finished high school, do you come back to New Iberia at that time?	20:37
Alfred James Smith	No. No. No. After I finished high school there, I stayed on and did my freshman year and sophomore year in college, see?	20:54
Felix Armfield	Okay. what are you studying in those years of college?	20:59
Alfred James Smith	Well, my main interest was music because I started taking music lessons when I was about nine years old.	21:07
Felix Armfield	So you started taking music lessons relatively young.	21:16
Alfred James Smith	Yeah. Nine or 10 years old because I had a very good music teacher, Ed Reedham. He's a violinist. That is the first instrument I tackled. I studied the violin.	21:19
Felix Armfield	Which one?	21:31
Alfred James Smith	Violin.	21:32
Felix Armfield	Okay.	21:32
Alfred James Smith	Under him. When I went to school in New Orleans, I studied under Professor Nicholson. He had a daughter, Carmil Nicholson that taught at Oberlin Conservatory, and I studied the violin under him quite a while.	21:32
Felix Armfield	That was Professor Nicholson?	21:47
Alfred James Smith	Yeah.	21:48
Felix Armfield	Who was your teacher here?	21:48
Alfred James Smith	Ed Reedham.	21:48
Felix Armfield	Ed Reedham?	21:48
Alfred James Smith	Uh-huh. He was my first music teacher, violin. I studied the violin. They had a very good orchestra. Banner Orchestra was the name of it, and he was—	21:54
Felix Armfield	Who was the teacher again when you got to New Orleans? I forgot.	22:07
Alfred James Smith	Professor Nicholson. He had a daughter by the name of Carmil Nicholson, who taught at Oberlin Conservatory.	22:11
Felix Armfield	Okay. Over at the Oberlin Conservatory?	22:23
Alfred James Smith	Uh-huh.	22:25
Felix Armfield	Okay. Now, what were you saying about your first lessons here?	22:27
Alfred James Smith	Was the violin. Studied under Ed Reedham was my instructor. At that time, New Iberia had an excellent orchestra, about nine, 10 pieces. They kept busy, and they played mostly all the big White society dances and things of the kind. They played it. Ed Reedham was the leader of that band. That is my first music teacher.	22:33
Felix Armfield	Now, was this a Black man?	22:57
Alfred James Smith	Yeah.	22:59
Felix Armfield	What was it that gave you this great love of music, Mr. Smith.	23:04
Alfred James Smith	I don't know. They tell me, even as a child, four or five years old, if I heard any music, my foot went to tapping.	23:08
Felix Armfield	Oh, really?	23:20
Alfred James Smith	Uh-huh. As I grew up and got older, when I changed from the violin to the saxophone, went to the saxophone—	23:20
Felix Armfield	Played the saxophone?	23:24
Alfred James Smith	—then I went into the dance orchestra business.	23:24
Felix Armfield	Then you could get ready to—	23:24
Alfred James Smith	Yeah. Well, the saxophones came in and the thing of the kind, and they kind of knocked the violins out. I do special numbers sometime on the violin in the waltz category. But I played tenor saxophone. I'd say my first professional job, I met a young man. Well, I knew of this man long before I left here to go to college. It was a band. The name of it is Louisiana Black Devil Band. The guys—	23:33
Felix Armfield	[indistinct 00:24:17]—	24:16
Alfred James Smith	Black Devil Band. They come from Plaquemine, Louisiana. They were one of the outstanding dance bands in this area. Whenever they would come to town, if I was in town here, I would go to hear them play. When I got in New Orleans at Straight College, one of the young men students there, he was from Plaquemine, where this band was headquartered.	24:17
Felix Armfield	From Plaquemine?	24:51
Alfred James Smith	Plaquemine, Louisiana. I got to talk with him about the band. He knew all the fellas in the band because he was from that little town. So he said, yeah, he knew all the fellas in the band. Joe Walker was manager of the band and thing of the kind, a friend of his daddy's, thing of the kind. That summer just before school closed, he contacted the Black Devil fellas in Plaquemine to tell them about me and that I would be interested in working with them during the summer if they had openings.	24:57
Alfred James Smith	He saw that they added another saxophone, which made a full section with me. After school closed, I toured with them that summer.	25:34
Felix Armfield	Oh, really?	25:47
Alfred James Smith	Uh-huh. I worked all the summer with them, and that is my first professional job.	25:50
Felix Armfield	Okay. Okay. So you went big time then, huh? Your first—	25:57
Alfred James Smith	Oh, yeah. From then on, I worked from then—	25:57
Felix Armfield	So what kind of places and where did you tour and what were your shows—	25:59
Alfred James Smith	Well, they were playing at that time it was mostly around in the Louisiana area here. This Louisiana area with the White people is a great dance place. That is the Sunday night dances and Sunday dances and thing of the kind, these Cajuns. The Black Devil Band had a good reputation. They played with a lot of White dances, mostly White dances. So during the summer while I was on vacation, I had an opportunity to work with them.	26:10
Alfred James Smith	The business manager of that outfit, his name was Joe Walker. I got along fine with them. They wanted me to stay on with them. I told them, no, I had to go back to school in September. So—	26:42
Felix Armfield	Why were they called the Louisiana Black Devils?	27:01
Alfred James Smith	I don't know. That is the name they give it. I don't know. God knows. I don't know.	27:08
Felix Armfield	But you played with the Louisiana Black Devil Band that summer?	27:09
Alfred James Smith	Yeah. Uh-huh.	27:12
Felix Armfield	But as you were touring throughout Louisiana, what happened if you were on the road? Could you stay anywhere you wanted to?	27:15
Alfred James Smith	No. That's a good question. Back in those times, you couldn't go in no hotel. There was no hotel or nothing for you to get a room at or anything of the kind. Now, I'll give you an example.	27:22
Felix Armfield	I assume we're talking about still the 1920s here?	27:38
Alfred James Smith	Oh yeah, yeah. In the '20s up until—	27:42
Felix Armfield	But during the time that you were traveling with them?	27:44
Alfred James Smith	During the time I was traveling, you couldn't get no accommodation in—	27:45
Felix Armfield	When you did that tour with them, that was in the 1920s, wasn't it?	27:45
Alfred James Smith	Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's in the—	27:45
Felix Armfield	The early '20s.	27:45
Alfred James Smith	Yeah, you take all that early '20s up until, say, the early '30s. Accommodations was very bad for Blacks. Anyway, these the hotels and things in New Orleans, you couldn't get no room or nothing there. You understand? If somebody's private house had an extra room, they'd take you in or something that a way. That was all the way around. When I finally left New Orleans, I went to Jackson, Tennessee, and I worked with Johnny Brown's Band out of Jackson, Tennessee.	27:55
Alfred James Smith	Now, we toured all through Tennessee, the northern edge of Mississippi, and Cary, Illinois, and around in that area there. There was no accommodations nowhere there for Colored. Somebody had a large rooming house, you understand? They was glad to take you in to make that extra money or something of the kind. But there's no hotel accommodation for Blacks at all.	28:22
Alfred James Smith	We played at White dances at hotels and thing of the kind, and we couldn't go up to the dance floor on the elevator past the elevator. We had to go around through the alley and go on the freight elevator where they bring the slop and stuff down there. That's right. Things are altogether different now in the world. For instance, I went into, let's see, it was Birmingham. Yeah, I think it was Birmingham. I was with Johnny Brown's Band out of Jackson, Tennessee.	28:46
Alfred James Smith	We was playing a White dance there and a Black dance there. Schoolteachers had a club, and we was playing a dance where we had just played a White dance at. As we was driving into town, I saw a big laundry. We'd been out about 10 days on the road, and I had four white shirts I wanted laundered. We was going to be there two days. I put them in special, I'd be able to get them the next day.	29:23
Alfred James Smith	So after we got to the rooming house and thing of the kind, I walked back about five blocks where I passed this laundry. So I opened the door and walked on, had these shirts wrapped up. The man in the laundry, he's standing. He saw me come in the door, and he's standing looking out the window. I stood there a good five minutes. He come there, "What you want?" I said, "I have—"	29:50
Felix Armfield	Now, this was happening where?	30:18
Alfred James Smith	This was in Birmingham, Alabama.	30:19
Felix Armfield	In Birmingham. Okay.	30:28
Alfred James Smith	I think I had four white shirts. I said, "I'd like to put these white shirts in special so I can get them tomorrow evening sometime before you close." He looked at me. He said, "You must be with that nigger band that's playing at Central Hotel tonight." We was playing the White dance first. Then the next night, we was playing the Colored dance. I said, "Yeah, that's right. Johnny Brown's Band out of Jackson, Tennessee."	30:28
Alfred James Smith	He said, "Well, look, we don't do nigger laundry here." He said, "Come, I'll show you where to go." He walked me to the door. He said, "Go down that next block and turn right. There's a chink laundry in the middle of the block. That where the niggers carry their clothes."	30:52
Felix Armfield	Are you kidding?	31:05
Alfred James Smith	Oh, man. It was tough back in that time.	31:10
Felix Armfield	How did you respond to him?	31:11
Alfred James Smith	Well, nothing for me to do. He wasn't going to take my shirts, and I had four or five white shirts I wanted laundered. We was going to be there two days. You see? I put them in special. So I went to find the Chinaman. He looked at me and said, "That's right. You with the band that's playing the Century Hotel." I said, "Uh-huh." He said, "Well, look, we don't take nigger clothes here. Come here. I'll show you." He walked to the door.	31:14
Alfred James Smith	"Well, you see? Go down there and make a right turn to that next corner. And then in the middle of the block is a chink laundry. Niggers can take clothes there." Lord, I'm telling you, things are good now to what it used to be for Blacks. There was no accommodation for you at all. Colored people had rooming houses and things of the kind. Some of them were nice, and some of them were pretty rough. Some of them was hardly fit for a dog to go in. But what you going to do?	31:38
Felix Armfield	You were telling me about two particular individuals on Saturday at the barber when we initially met.	32:18
Alfred James Smith	Oh, yeah.	32:27
Felix Armfield	You were telling me about Bunk Johnson.	32:28
Alfred James Smith	Oh, yeah. Bunk Johnson. Yeah. He's a good trumpet player.	32:30
Felix Armfield	And what was the other gentleman's name? Gus Spartnick.	32:33
Alfred James Smith	Gus Spartnick was manager of the band here at Iberia. The Banner Orchestra, it was the name of the orchestra, a very good band. The violin player was my first music teacher.	32:37
Felix Armfield	Did you ever play with Johnson and Gus—	32:57
Alfred James Smith	No. No. I never did play in the orchestra with the band here. I was always out of town because I was in Donaldsonville a while when school closed.	33:01
Felix Armfield	You went where?	33:12
Alfred James Smith	Donaldsonville. That where the Black Devil Band headquarters was at the time.	33:13
Felix Armfield	That's here in Louisiana?	33:18
Alfred James Smith	In Louisiana, yeah, yeah. That's about 70 miles from here.	33:21
Felix Armfield	Okay. I see.	33:25
Alfred James Smith	Then when I left school, I joined Victor's Band out of Baton Rouge. That was a large traveling orchestra, 12-piece band, large band.	33:26
Felix Armfield	And you were still playing saxophone?	34:02
Alfred James Smith	Oh, yeah. Yeah. Now, Victor's Band, we played a lot of LSU, students with LSU, and thing of the kind. We went on football trips. We did.	34:10
Felix Armfield	Is that where you were telling me that you encountered Huey P. Long?	34:20
Alfred James Smith	Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.	34:23
Felix Armfield	So in the was late '20s and early '30s?	34:23
Alfred James Smith	That was the early '30s. Yeah. Old Huey.0	34:27
Felix Armfield	Now, what are some of your memories of having an encounter—	34:32
Alfred James Smith	With—	34:33
Felix Armfield	—with Huey P. Long?	34:33
Alfred James Smith	With Huey P. Long? Well—	34:33
Felix Armfield	Did you and he have a decent relationship?	34:33
Alfred James Smith	Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.	34:33
Felix Armfield	He would talk?	34:33
Alfred James Smith	Yeah. Yeah, he talked. I'll tell you what he used to do. Whenever we played at White dances in Baton Rouge, if he was in town before he got to going back far to Washington and thing of the kind, he would always be there because a lot of the LSU students was there. A lot of times, their clubs we played for and thing of the kind. Because we played quite a few, most of the dancing and thing, he knew all of us by first name.	34:48
Alfred James Smith	He was all right. He was kind of rough in the edges. He wasn't no college graduate or nothing of the kind. But he was a good old Cajun. He did a lot for Louisiana. All these good roads, highways, and bridges and thing of the kind, he's responsible for that because a hog would get bogged on these highways and things. I'm telling you. I'll give you an example of what I'm talking about. In North Louisiana, there's the Red River going up to Bunkie and around that area. They didn't have no bridges.	35:22
Alfred James Smith	You'd have to cross on the ferry. Some old White guy, he would have a little barge that hold about two cars, you understand, and a four or five-cylinder boat that would pull that barge across the river, hook onto the side and got it across the river. Sometime he may charge you $5 a car to cross. Then if he's a good human, he may charge you $3 to cross. Whatever he want, you had to pay to cross. That's particularly that Red river up in north Louisiana here.	35:51
Alfred James Smith	All these nice bridges and highways and thing, now you see it was started by Huey Long. Negroes couldn't register to vote or nothing until he made it possible.	36:29
Felix Armfield	Now, what did he do to make that possible?	36:42
Alfred James Smith	Well, he was governor. After he got to be governor of Louisiana, his word was law. They used to call him The Kingfish. You might have heard of that?	36:46
Felix Armfield	Mm-hmm. Huey Kingfish Long.	36:52
Alfred James Smith	That's right. That's right. I'm telling you. He really pulled Louisiana out of the hole for years. I heard him talk about putting a bridge across the Mississippi River in New Orleans. That bridge wasn't built until Huey Long got to be governor and thing of the kind. He said, "I'm going to build it." Everybody talking about the current is too strong. He used to have a saying, "These goddamn [indistinct 00:37:21]. The current is too strong. No bridge can't be put across the Mississippi River here. The current is too strong, the water too deep. Goddammit, I'm going to put a bridge cross there if I have to send to England to get some engineers." And he did, too.	36:55
Alfred James Smith	If I'm not mistaken now, I think it's some engineers from France he got to come here and put the foundation of that bridge and thing down. He cursed out Tulane University thing there. "You can't got no engineers turning out, talking about the water too wet or either the current is too strong. Goddammit, I'm going to put a bridge here." So he got that bridge there. That bridge over going into New Orleans was his project.	37:38
Felix Armfield	Well, isn't that the bridge's name? Huey P. Long Bridge there?	38:06
Alfred James Smith	I think it is. I think it is. I done forgot about it. Yeah, he's the one put that bridge there.	38:06
Felix Armfield	Now, you were telling me a couple of stories on Saturday as we sat and chitchatted at the shop. Unfortunately, we didn't have the tape recorder on then.	38:19
Alfred James Smith	Yeah.	38:26
Felix Armfield	But I hope you can recall—	38:28
Alfred James Smith	What was it about?	38:30
Felix Armfield	—that you was telling me about what would happen when you all would go and try and register to vote there in New Orleans.	38:33
Alfred James Smith	Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.	38:38
Felix Armfield	Especially Blacks who were even attempting to vote.	38:42
Alfred James Smith	That's right. Right at the registration office.	38:43
Felix Armfield	What would happen? What was that process like?	38:46
Alfred James Smith	Well, they'd take the card. They wouldn't refuse you the card to fill out.	38:49
Felix Armfield	They would not?	38:52
Alfred James Smith	No, no, no. They'd give it to you. But all they asked for there was your name, your address, your age, what year you was born in, your birthday, and thing of the kind. I stood there one day. I was there trying to register. Too. Dr. Sigue, who was Black—	38:53
Felix Armfield	This was in New Orleans?	39:11
Alfred James Smith	Yes, I was in New Orleans. He was in line. Then Dr. Taylor behind, then me behind Dr. Taylor. Now, you can't tell me Dr. Sigue and Dr. Taylor didn't know how to fill out that registration card. That's all they—	39:12
Felix Armfield	This was in the early '30s?	39:30
Alfred James Smith	Oh, hell yeah. That was the early '30s. All they asked you there is your name and address and just ordinary things, which the average person who could read and write knew. They take it and look at it, "Nope, error on here." Tear it up. They wouldn't give you another card or tell you what they thought about it. "Come back again." Do all that kind of stuff to intimidate you.	39:31
Alfred James Smith	About three or four weeks after that, I was back in Baton Rouge, and we were playing a White dance there. Huey was there. He came there and come up on the bandstand. He knew all of us by first name.	39:58
Felix Armfield	So who was there?	40:16
Alfred James Smith	Huey Long.	40:16
Felix Armfield	Okay.	40:16
Alfred James Smith	He came up on the bandstand and talked with us and thing of the kind. I was telling him about that. He said, "Well, hell, it ain't nothing that —You mean to tell me Dr. Taylor or Dr. Sigue can't fill out one of them cards?"I said, "Well, they filled it out. The man tore it up. I was right there." He said, "All right. I'm going to see about that." He put a stop to that.	40:19
Felix Armfield	You got registered after that?	40:44
Alfred James Smith	Oh, yeah, yeah. We got registered. Well, I'll tell you what he did. He called out a company of the state militia and put them in the registration office. I didn't know what he was going to do. But about a week or so after that, I went back there. There was one sitting in the window with a rifle across his shoulder, two standing in the door you had to go through, and one standing at the counter right at the registration office.	40:48
Alfred James Smith	I said, "Well, well, well. See, he made it possible for Negroes to register and vote. He made it possible. He did a lot of good for the state, [indistinct 00:41:27].	41:09
Felix Armfield	What was the other situation that you mentioned to me where he wrote a letter to someone and you were able to get that job?	41:31
Alfred James Smith	Oh, oh, oh, yeah, yeah. Well, when I left Baton Rouge, left Victor" band because I was half sick and I was having a lot of problems. I told him. I said, "Well, Governor—" He was talking about one of the big football games that he wanted the band to go to Vanderbilt. I said, "Well, I ain't going to be with y'all on that trip." I said, "I'm leaving." He said, "What's the matter? Vic ain't treating you right, Alfred?" I said, "Oh, no, it ain't Vic." I explained to him my condition and thing of the kind.	41:42
Alfred James Smith	He said, "You got a family?" I said, "I got a wife and one child." He said, "Well, you going to need something to do, a job or something." He said, "When you planning to go?" I said, "I got two more weeks here with Vic." He said, "Well, you remind me of it before you go. I'm going to give you a letter to give Mr. Guidry, the personnel director of Charity Hospital. They'll give you something to do because you have to have something to do, an income of some kind."	42:14
Felix Armfield	At the Charity Hospital?	42:45
Alfred James Smith	That's right. The Charity Hospital. So he did. I got a job there through him. Every time he would pass through New Orleans, stop there. And then that is the old Charity Hospital. They hadn't built this hospital here. Whenever he'd come through there, he'd always come there, go around the place there and thing of the kind, nursing office and ask for me. Them sisters would say, "Alfred, go change that uniform. Put on a clean uniform." I'd say, "Sister, I just got this uniform yesterday." "Don't argue with me, man."	42:47
Alfred James Smith	Them Catholic sisters, they learn you how to work though. They work the stuffing out you. They will learn you how to work. They know what it's all about. Any hospital that you go to them Catholic Sisters run, you got good attention there. They really know their business.	43:27
Felix Armfield	Now, tell me about the scenario that you told me about, how you walked in the office and the woman said, "Well, we ain't got no work."	43:50
Alfred James Smith	I walked in the office and, "We not hiring nobody today, boy." Well, Huey Long just had turned out. His strategy was this, to get them —He made it possible for Negroes to register and vote. But to make everybody vote the way he wanted them and thing of the kind, especially them White people, they let out a gang of them. They fired a gang of them.	43:56
Felix Armfield	At Charity?	44:26
Alfred James Smith	That's right. Everybody scared to lose their job and other jobs that he controlled, the state jobs, too. You see? Then he took them back with the understanding that they'd vote for him. That's why he had such a following. If he hadn't been assassinated, he had a good chance of becoming president of the United States, in my opinion. I really believe that.	44:30
Felix Armfield	Okay. Now, what happened when you took the letter to the people there at Charity?	45:08
Alfred James Smith	I walked into the personnel office. Old White girl sitting at the desk down in the office. As soon as I walk in, "Boy, we not hiring nobody." I said, "Lady, I didn't come here to get burned. I got a letter here. Give that to Mr. Guidry. This is from Governor Long." She look at the letter with his seal stamped on it. She run in the back office, give it to this old Cajun back there. They was political jobs. Give it to him.	45:14
Alfred James Smith	After a while, he come to the door. "You Alfred?" I said, "Yes, sir." "Come in, Alfred. Come in. Come in." I don't know what the hell Long had on that letter. He took the letter. He read it, and he said, "Governor Long thinks very well of you." I said, "Yes, sir, I know." So he told his secretary. He said, "Take this boy over to Sister Colette and tell her to give him a job, give him something to do.	45:46
Alfred James Smith	So the girl took, "Follow me." Her expression, everything had changed then. Walked in there. Sister Colette, "Sister, Mr. Guidry told me to bring this boy over." "I got enough of them lazy boys. I don't need nobody." The girl say, "Well, look, Mr. Guidry said this boy was sent here by Governor Long, and Mr. Guidry said put him on the payroll if he just got to hold your prayer beads and walk around with them." So there's that. Lord, have mercy.	46:07

Alfred James Smith	So—	0:00
Felix Armfield	Did you serve in the war?	0:06
Alfred James Smith	No. No, because I had disability, you know. I had polio when I was five years old.	0:07
Felix Armfield	Okay. Okay.	0:11
Alfred James Smith	Uh-huh. I'm trying to think how many years I stayed at Charity Hospital. Did I tell you?	0:23
Felix Armfield	No, you didn't. Did you retire from there?	0:27
Alfred James Smith	No, I didn't retire. I just left. Decided to leave New Orleans. I went to New York.	0:30
Felix Armfield	To New York?	0:36
Alfred James Smith	Uh-huh.	0:39
Felix Armfield	And when did you leave New Orleans to go to New York?	0:39
Alfred James Smith	Oh, that was in, wait a minute, I think it was '44. About '44. My memory ain't too good these days. I went to New York and with my hospital experience and thing, I got a job right away. Montefiore Medical Center and I stayed there about seven years, I think, if I remember correctly. That's where I got a chance to go into the nursing field.	0:41
Felix Armfield	Into the nursing field?	1:31
Alfred James Smith	Yeah. I got a New York State Licensed Practical Nurse.	1:36
Felix Armfield	Okay. So you actually did nursing?	1:38
Alfred James Smith	Oh, yeah.	1:41
Felix Armfield	In New York.	1:41
Alfred James Smith	In New York, yeah.	1:41
Felix Armfield	Now, how many years did you remain in New York, Mr. Smith?	1:43
Alfred James Smith	Oh God. Let me see.	1:44
Felix Armfield	[indistinct 00:01:56].	1:44
Alfred James Smith	I don't know. Somewhere around, let me see now. Stayed in New York about seven, eight years.	1:59
Felix Armfield	Okay.	2:13
Alfred James Smith	Or eight or nine years, one, because I came here when I retired. I came on down here. It was a good eight or nine years. My memory's kind of fuzzy now.	2:16
Felix Armfield	At some point I think you said to me that you spent some time in Chicago as well.	2:38
Alfred James Smith	Oh yeah. Well that is earlier years. That is back in the '30s.	2:42
Felix Armfield	Uh-huh. Okay.	2:45
Alfred James Smith	That was back in the '30s.	2:45
Felix Armfield	Now what were you doing in Chicago?	2:50
Alfred James Smith	Oh—	2:51
Felix Armfield	Were you playing music at that time?	2:53
Alfred James Smith	As a sideline. I had went to Chicago and I went to school there, to a business school there where I used to do Gregg shorthand and I won a couple of medals in typewriting at the Underwood Company and the Royal Company [indistinct 00:03:20]. You see, my mother always wanted me to prepare myself to do office work. When back at that time, Negroes had no business. The Negro insurance company's a family set up. You understand?	2:55
Felix Armfield	Uh-huh.	3:37
Alfred James Smith	You had as much chance getting a job in there as swimming the Mississippi River backwards. You understand?	3:38
Felix Armfield	Uh-huh.	3:44
Alfred James Smith	But to please them I just went along and took it. See, but it hadn't been for my musical ability—That where I got my income from because because there was a time I could do Gregg shorthand that I want to say about 80 words a minute, but getting a job during that era, White people wasn't hired Negroes into their business in that era and the Negro business, Negro Insurance Company, think it was a family affair. You understand?	3:46
Felix Armfield	Uh-huh.	4:18
Alfred James Smith	So I had to fall back on my music for a livelihood. I never did—I knew it was a lost cause. But in order that this, not contrary my mother, I just went along with the deal because the only Negros was working in offices then was probably relatives of these Negro insurance concerns. And that was a family setup. You didn't have much of a chance getting in there.	4:19
Felix Armfield	When you did return to New Iberia, what kind of New Iberia did you return to as opposed to the Iberia that you had left many years ago?	5:23
Alfred James Smith	Oh, well, there's quite a bit of improvement. Not a whole lot because this was always a close community with the White and the Blacks. You understand? Because you take this street here, this family here, Ms. Simon here, her family always lived in this house here. You understand? And the next door there, that house there was for the King family. That was a Colored family. But across the street where this office building is, there was White families there. There's a White family right there. It was very good friends to Miss Simon here, and it is integrated in.	5:31
Felix Armfield	Okay.	6:15
Alfred James Smith	Yeah.	6:16
Felix Armfield	Okay.	6:16
Alfred James Smith	We never had was, I don't remember any fiction between the White and the Blacks when I was a kid growing up here.	6:20
Felix Armfield	You think that perhaps may have been because, for the most part, Black people knew their place?	6:30
Alfred James Smith	That is partly that too. But these Cajuns, they were always—They all got along together with the Blacks. For instance, hospitals wasn't popular then at that time. Most people died at home, but just stayed sick at home [indistinct 00:06:57] and if a Black family had somebody very sick at the home, the White neighbor would come in and help with him or sit up at night with them and [indistinct 00:07:05]. Because I had polio when I was five years old. And my grandmother had White friends in the neighborhood who would come there and help with me and set up with me and [indistinct 00:07:17]. Because at that time, the only time you went in the hospital, you went in there to die. People thought that.	6:36
Felix Armfield	Did you have any Black doctors in town? In those areas?	7:27
Alfred James Smith	Well, back at that time we had one Black doctor here that I know, Dr. Welch, TL Welch. Dr. Welch was the first Black doctor I know of. Then there's a Dr. Easter, another Black doctor.	7:31
Felix Armfield	One Black doctor.	7:45
Alfred James Smith	Because Dr. Easter is the one vaccinated me for smallpox. They had a smallpox epidemic. Yeah. Yeah, there were two Black doctors to my remember, Dr. Easter and Dr. Welch.	7:50
Felix Armfield	Okay. Dr. Easter?	8:08
Alfred James Smith	Uh-huh.	8:09
Felix Armfield	Dr. Welch?	8:11
Alfred James Smith	That's right.	8:11
Felix Armfield	Now was either of them a female or they both were—	8:18
Alfred James Smith	They both are male doctors.	8:24
Felix Armfield	Were two Black male doctors.	8:24
Alfred James Smith	Two Black male doctors.	8:25
Felix Armfield	Okay. And how long did they stay here in Iberia?	8:25
Alfred James Smith	Oh, I left him here, but I went to New Orleans School.	8:30
Felix Armfield	Okay.	8:35
Alfred James Smith	And shortly, my first year at school in New Orleans, my grandfather died. I came back here for his funeral and my grandmother stayed here. Oh, she probably stayed here about eight or nine months afterwards. And she left and went to Orange, Texas to live with my mother.	8:36
Felix Armfield	To live with your mother.	9:01
Alfred James Smith	Uh-huh.	9:02
Felix Armfield	Okay. Now these were your mother's parents that you were living with.	9:04
Alfred James Smith	That's right. That's right. That's right.	9:06
Felix Armfield	And that's when you gave up the family home here in Iberia?	9:11
Alfred James Smith	Yes. My grandmother, she moved on to Orange, Texas with my mother and she rented the place out. The house is still standing. 427 Field Street, big white house, still standing. My grandmother rented it out.	9:16
Felix Armfield	Now do you still own the property?	9:30
Alfred James Smith	No, no. Couple of years. And the people's tearing up the property so she finally sold it. She sold it before she died.	9:32
Felix Armfield	Okay.	9:39
Alfred James Smith	And that house is still standing at 427 Field Street. It's near the corner of Corinne, the side the bank is now. The house next to it, that house wasn't there then because all that property, that land there, went with my grandmother's house, went with the 427 Field Street house.	9:39
Felix Armfield	Oh, really?	10:04
Alfred James Smith	Uh-huh. Where my grandmother, after she moved to Texas with my mother.	10:05
Felix Armfield	And this was after you left here to go to New Orleans?	10:09
Alfred James Smith	Oh yes. Oh yes. All that happened after—Let's see, my grandfather died. I was still in school in New Orleans. I think it was my second year there because I came, they sent for me to come home. And the next day after I got here, he died. Because I always stayed with my grandmother and my grandfather most when I stayed with my mother in Orange, because I didn't like Orange, Texas. All my friends were here. And I didn't like Orange, Texas. Orange was a hell of a place there. You could go out there in the water and see a Negro hanging by his neck in Orange. There's a lynch mob place at Orange, Texas there at the town.	10:12
Felix Armfield	Oh, really?	10:53
Alfred James Smith	Soon you leave Lake Charles, Louisiana, about 40 miles, you get over into Texas. The first town in the state of Texas. Orange Texas.	10:54
Felix Armfield	Orange Texas.	11:04
Alfred James Smith	I never did like that. I wouldn't go. I went to school one or two years there and I came back here because I never did like Orange, Texas. I never did like Orange, Texas.	11:06
Felix Armfield	Now do you recall anyone in particular that you knew of that was lynched while you were growing up here in New Iberia?	11:34
Alfred James Smith	No, we never had that here in Iberia. I tell you, I can tell you an inc—	11:40
Felix Armfield	In the surrounding areas?	11:46
Alfred James Smith	Well, if I'm not mistaken, I heard my grandmother talk about they lynched a Colored man in St. Martinville. That's about 50 miles from here. But we never had that here. They always had pretty fair peace before. I'll give you an example. There was a White man found dead on the railroad track. The railroad coming from the salt mine from Avery's Island in Iberia. And a bunch of these rabble-rousing Cajuns here, they got in the street looking for somebody. They say there's a nigger killed a White man. That is the expression then.	11:48
Alfred James Smith	And White man by the name of George Henderson was the sheriff here. He and my grandfather were good friends. But they used to hunt together when my grandpa would be in town. My grandpa come in town, he'd bring game to Sheriff Henderson [indistinct 00:12:48]. And I remember that is the wintertime. We were all sitting around there in one of the rooms. Each room had a fireplace with a grate in. We'd burn coal. And I believe my grandma's popping some popcorn or something. Somebody they knock at the door, it's Sheriff Henderson. At the time, he and my grandfather were great friends, and they had arrested a Colored fellow on suspicion of murder.	12:27
Alfred James Smith	A White man was found murdered on the salt mine track. Come from the salt mine.	13:23
Felix Armfield	Not the railroad track?	13:27
Alfred James Smith	Huh? On the railroad track.	13:28
Felix Armfield	Okay.	13:30
Alfred James Smith	Yeah, on the railroad track. So he came. We were all sitting, it was the wintertime. We was popping popcorn and sitting there talking, knocked at the door. My grandma went to the door. So I heard my grandma said, "Come in, sheriff, come in. Yeah, we all, having some popcorn." He came in. So he told my grandpa, he said, "Jim, I want you to do something." He said, "We found a White fellow killed on the salt mine track, on the railroad track there. And these crazy Cajun here, they want to start some trouble here. They figure some Black man killed him." And he said, "The man wasn't killed by no Black man. And they got a boy, I had to arrest a boy and lock him up in jail for safekeeping." And he said, "They're trying to form a lynch mob." And he said, "What I'm going to do, I just called Sheriff Muto, the sheriff at Lafayette and telling him that I'm going to sneak him out of jail and send him there. And I want you to take him."	13:30
Alfred James Smith	He said, "I got a skiff." The jail still sits on the Bayou Teche down here. He said, "There's a skiff I got tied up behind the jail there. Now, I'm going to load this guy out the jail on a rope." He said, "I know this boy didn't kill this White man, but these crazy Cajuns here, they just want some Negro to lynch and I'm not going to have that here." So my grandpa reach up and got his Winchester rifle and left with the sheriff. I was about, oh, about six or seven years old, the winter time too. And the sheriff turned this fellow over to my grandpa. My grandpa got in the skiff behind the jail because the jail sits right on the bayou, still sits on the bayou like it is there now, and loaded him down in the skiff.	14:35
Alfred James Smith	And he had called the sheriff and Lafayette that he was sending this man there with my grandfather for safekeeping. You know? Say, because he was—	15:30
Felix Armfield	Do you know whatever happened to the man?	15:42
Alfred James Smith	No, I don't remember. I don't remember because I was about seven, eight years old then. I don't think because this Sheriff Henderson, he said, "I know that boy didn't kill this man." He said, "But these Cajuns all drunk and they wants to lynch and I ain't going have that here." So that's how that—But how it ever come out, I don't know. Because I was just about, I must have been about six years old or seven years old.	15:45
Felix Armfield	I see.	16:08
Alfred James Smith	But to my knowledge, nothing like that never happened here. I understand they had something like that happen in St. Martinville. That's a little town 16 miles from here. But we never had that here.	16:12
Felix Armfield	Sounds like they were getting ready to let something like that happen.	16:22
Alfred James Smith	Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, few drunk rabble-rousers. And Henderson was a good law enforcement officer. He's a sheriff that's no nonsense.	16:22
Felix Armfield	Henderson?	16:35
Alfred James Smith	Yeah. Sheriff Henderson. You go in the lobby of the courthouse over there—You know where the new courthouse building over there? In the lobby you see Sheriff Henderson on the wall because the picture all up in the lobby there. On the what you call them there.	16:35
Felix Armfield	Okay. I think I'll maybe get a chance to stop by there and see that before I leave town.	16:57
Alfred James Smith	Yeah.	17:04
Felix Armfield	Okay. If you don't have anything else that you just particularly want to say—	17:06
Alfred James Smith	Well, I don't, that's about—Anything you got in mind? You got to remind me everything.	17:10
Felix Armfield	Well, what I'm going to do is I'm going to take some time to fill out some brief paperwork with you to get your family history, and as we talk, you never know.	17:16
Alfred James Smith	Yeah. Something come up.	17:25
Felix Armfield	Because another story may come up. So we'll keep the tape recorder running and we'll get the family history. Well, the paperwork. Now your last name is Smith.	17:27
Alfred James Smith	Right?	17:37
Felix Armfield	And your first name is	17:39
Alfred James Smith	Alfred.	17:41
Felix Armfield	A-L-F-R-E-D.	17:41
Alfred James Smith	Alfred J. Smith. J for James.	17:44
Felix Armfield	Alfred J. Smith. And the address here is 522?	17:47
Alfred James Smith	Wheat Street.	17:54
Felix Armfield	Wheat Street. And this is New Iberia.	17:55
Alfred James Smith	Yeah, New Iberia, Louisiana. Now, my birth place and where I was reared at is—	18:01
Felix Armfield	I'm going to ask you that in a minute.	18:09
Alfred James Smith	Oh, oh, okay, okay, okay, okay.	18:09
Felix Armfield	We're going to get to all of that.	18:09
Alfred James Smith	Okay. Okay.	18:14
Felix Armfield	What's your birthdate?	18:15
Alfred James Smith	January the 29th, 1907.	18:16
Felix Armfield	January the 29th, 19-	18:20
Alfred James Smith	07.	18:24
Felix Armfield	07. And you've been blessed to be around quite a while.	18:26
Alfred James Smith	I'm going downhill gradually though. Old age is caught up with me.	18:28
Felix Armfield	You just got a head cold. It'll be okay.	18:33
Alfred James Smith	Got more than a head cold. My memory's bad.	18:36
Felix Armfield	Yeah.	18:39
Alfred James Smith	It's better now.	18:42
Felix Armfield	Believe me—	18:42
Alfred James Smith	It's better now in the last two weeks than it was a month ago.	18:43
Felix Armfield	Uh-huh. So you really have good days and bad days.	18:46
Alfred James Smith	Oh yeah. Yeah. Well, I've improved. My memory improved a lot. I had some very bad experience in New Orleans there with my family, my daughter, and taking the car. And that's why these young people, they take advantage and take of the car and I'm going to let them go so far and no further. And that upset me quite a bit. That's why I left New Orleans and came out here. And Ms. Simon here, my friend, we've been friends a long time. She gave me a place to stay here and recuperate. And my doctor, Dr. Castro, I knew him in New York. I was surprised when I come here and find him here. He's taking care of me. So I'm comfortable.	18:49
Felix Armfield	I trust [indistinct 00:19:44]. Yeah. Now your place of birth? You were born—	19:39
Alfred James Smith	New Iberia. 427 Field Street.	19:45
Felix Armfield	And that's Iberia Parish?	19:49
Alfred James Smith	Uh-huh.	19:49
Felix Armfield	And your principal occupation? You were a musician?	20:00
Alfred James Smith	I was a musician. And in my later years after I went to New York, I went to nursing school. And was an LPN, New York State license. And I worked at Montefiore Medical Center nine years.	20:09
Felix Armfield	Okay.This phone number here again?	20:58
Alfred James Smith	364-3184. Let me look again.	21:02
Felix Armfield	365, isn't it?	21:05
Alfred James Smith	365. I think.	21:05
Felix Armfield	365-3187.	21:09
Alfred James Smith	That's it. That's it. That's it.	21:11
Felix Armfield	Now for the official records as the materials that we are collecting will be housed at Duke University in the archives. For the official record, you want your name to be listed as Alfred J. Smith, or want to write out James?	21:14
Alfred James Smith	You can just put Alfred J. Smith. Either one. It doesn't make any difference.	21:33
Felix Armfield	Alfred J. Smith.	21:36
Alfred James Smith	Uh-huh.	21:38
Felix Armfield	Did you have a nickname of sorts?	21:38
Alfred James Smith	Let me see. Yes. Some of my boys I grew up around here with, used to call me Britt, B-R-I-T-T. I think they took that from some cowboy picture long years ago.	21:45
Felix Armfield	Okay. So local people, some of them know you as Britt.	21:59
Alfred James Smith	Yeah, I think I've outlived all that old bunch, though. My last friend died here about eight months ago.	22:05
Felix Armfield	Really? Now your marital status? Single, married, divorced, or widowed?	22:12
Alfred James Smith	I'm divorced.	22:21
Felix Armfield	What was your wife's name?	22:24
Alfred James Smith	Well, my first wife name was Elizabeth Samson. Elizabeth Samson. That's my children's mother.	22:28
Felix Armfield	Okay. Samson was the last name?	22:39
Alfred James Smith	He's a native from New Orleans.	22:42
Felix Armfield	Is that S-A-M-P-S-O-N?	22:44
Alfred James Smith	S-A-M-S-O-N. I think she said, that's way she spells. S-A-M-S-O-N.	22:50
Felix Armfield	Just S-A-M-S-O-N.	22:51
Alfred James Smith	Yes.	22:51
Felix Armfield	Okay. Did you remember her birthday?	22:58
Alfred James Smith	No. I sure don't.	22:59
Felix Armfield	Okay. Is she alive?	23:03
Alfred James Smith	No, she died. We separated, divorced. She remarried and she died, let me see, Elizabeth died since I retired and left New York and came here. I can't think of the date right now. And I'd have to look it up or call the kids and ask about it.	23:03
Felix Armfield	Okay. Do you recall where she was born?	23:38
Alfred James Smith	She was born here in New Orleans. In New Orleans.	23:40
Felix Armfield	In New Orleans?	23:43
Alfred James Smith	Uh-huh.	23:44
Felix Armfield	Is that where the two of you met?	23:47
Alfred James Smith	That's right.	23:48
Felix Armfield	And what was her occupation?	23:48
Alfred James Smith	She was a nurse. She worked for Touro Infirmary. Obstetrics was her specialty. Because at that time, Negroes could go to Touro Clinic, but they didn't admit no Negroes into the hospital as patients. And her specialty was obstetrics.	24:01
Felix Armfield	Okay.	24:27
Alfred James Smith	And say, for instance, women who went to Touro Clinic and come time for them to confine to have the child, they had them at home. So my wife delivered them at home. That was her job.	24:30
Felix Armfield	Okay. So she was a traveling nurse.	24:41
Alfred James Smith	Yeah.	24:45
Felix Armfield	She went door to door.	24:45
Alfred James Smith	That's right. And her chief, her doctor who she worked under was Dr. Abare.	24:47
Felix Armfield	Abare.	24:51
Alfred James Smith	He was chief of obstetrics at Touro Infirmary.	24:52
Felix Armfield	Okay. Was he in fact a Black man or White man?	24:56
Alfred James Smith	No, he was a White man.	24:58
Felix Armfield	Okay. Now, what was your mother's first name?	25:00
Alfred James Smith	My mother's first name was Alvertia. A-L-V-E-R-T-I-A, Alvertia Smith. She was a Smith and married a Smith. Her maiden name was Smith.	25:03
Felix Armfield	Oh. She never changed her name.	25:14
Alfred James Smith	Yeah.	25:14
Felix Armfield	A-L-V-E-R-T-I-A. Alvertia.	25:17
Alfred James Smith	That's right.	25:21
Felix Armfield	Now, and Smith was her maiden name?	25:22
Alfred James Smith	That's right. Uh-huh.	25:24
Felix Armfield	Okay. Do you recall your mother's birthdate?	25:30
Alfred James Smith	I sure don't.	25:33
Felix Armfield	Okay.	25:34
Felix Armfield	What about her death date?	25:37
Alfred James Smith	Let me see now. I'm trying to think. Let me see. Just let me see. I can't remember it right now.	25:42
Felix Armfield	Okay. What about your mother's place of birth? Where was your mother born?	26:06
Alfred James Smith	New Iberia. My father's home was New Iberia too.	26:19
Felix Armfield	And your mother, what was your mother's occupation?	26:25
Alfred James Smith	She was a hairdresser at one time. She ran a beauty parlor at one time.	26:31
Felix Armfield	Your father's first name?	26:38
Alfred James Smith	Alfred.	26:38
Felix Armfield	Alfred Smith, I assume?	26:43
Alfred James Smith	That's right.	26:45
Felix Armfield	Did he have a middle name?	26:45
Alfred James Smith	No.	26:47
Felix Armfield	Okay. And do you know your father's birthday?	26:49
Alfred James Smith	Right offhand? No.	26:58
Felix Armfield	Okay. Can you recall when he died?	27:00
Alfred James Smith	Wait a minute, I should. Let me see, I put my hand on this Bible. I think I got it correctly in here.	27:07
Felix Armfield	So you have your father's birthday in your Bible?	27:27
Alfred James Smith	It should be in here. I'm not sure. My mother had a real large Bible and that's two of the—I don't see any. For sure that is—	27:50
Felix Armfield	Well, that's okay. I mean, we only want what you know anyway. And you don't remember your father's birthdate nor when he died, right?	28:07
Alfred James Smith	No.	28:14
Felix Armfield	Okay. And your father was from New Iberia, also.	28:18
Alfred James Smith	New Iberia. Yes.	28:20
Felix Armfield	And your father's occupation?	28:30
Alfred James Smith	Worked at a sawmill, laborer.	28:33
Felix Armfield	Day laborer. Did you have brothers and sisters?	28:47
Alfred James Smith	I got one brother.	28:49
Felix Armfield	Okay. And what was his name?	28:51
Alfred James Smith	Hinton. H-I-N-T-O-N.	28:52
Felix Armfield	H-I-N-T-O-N.	28:55
Alfred James Smith	C. For Clyde.	28:57
Felix Armfield	Smith.	28:59
Alfred James Smith	Smith.	29:00
Felix Armfield	And what was your brother's birthday?	29:03
Alfred James Smith	Oh God, I'm seven years older than him.	29:04
Felix Armfield	And you were born in 1907, so he was born in 1914. Do you know—	29:07
Alfred James Smith	Just about, yeah.	29:11
Felix Armfield	Do you know his birthday?	29:12
Alfred James Smith	July. It's in the month of July, I know. But right offhand, I can't—	29:14
Felix Armfield	July 1914. Close enough. Is your brother still alive?	29:17
Alfred James Smith	Oh, yeah.	29:21
Felix Armfield	Okay. And where was he born?	29:23
Alfred James Smith	New Iberia. Yeah, he grew up and went to school in Orange, Texas though. I never did like Orange.	29:28
Felix Armfield	And you're the first child, right?	29:33
Alfred James Smith	I'm the first child. There's only two of us.	29:35
Felix Armfield	Okay. Now, do you have children?	29:38
Alfred James Smith	Yes.	29:41
Felix Armfield	Okay.	29:41
Alfred James Smith	Have two sons and a daughter. My eldest son died about a year and a half ago.	29:42
Felix Armfield	Okay. Well, give me your children's name in the order of their ages.	29:52
Alfred James Smith	Okay. Anthony E. Smith. That's my oldest boy. He died about three years ago in Veterans Hospital. He's a 30-year veteran in the army.	29:56
Felix Armfield	All right. What's your second child's?	30:15
Alfred James Smith	Alfred S. Smith.	30:17
Felix Armfield	And your youngest?	30:24
Alfred James Smith	My daughter Mary. Mary I. Parkman. P-A-R-K-M-A-N.	30:26
Felix Armfield	Okay. Do you remember all three of your children's birthday, Mr. Smith?	30:43
Alfred James Smith	I sure don't.	30:46
Felix Armfield	Okay. Do you remember Anthony's birthday? Your oldest?	30:50
Alfred James Smith	Wait a minute now. Wait a minute. Let's see. I'm having a sort of memory lapsing.	31:02
Felix Armfield	Uh-huh.	31:02
Alfred James Smith	Oh, Anthony was born in 19—I think I got that written down in another Bible, if I put my hand on it.	31:02
Felix Armfield	Go ahead.	31:21

Item Info

Title:

Alfred Smith interview recording, 1994 August 02

Date:

August 2, 1994

Creator:

Smith, Alfred James

Contributor:

Armfield, Felix

Description:

Name: Alfred J. Smith; Date of birth: 1907-01-29; Place of birth: New Iberia, LA; Occupation(s): musician; nursing; Residence: New Iberia, LA
Informant ID: 650; Interviewed by: Felix Armfield.

Occupation:

Location:

Format:

Language:

English

Digital Collection:

Behind the Veil

Source Collection:

Behind the Veil: Documenting African American Life in the Jim Crow South interviews, photographs, and project records, circa 1864-2011, bulk 1990-2004

Series:

Related Resources:

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Provenance:

The David M. Rubenstein Rare Book and Manuscript Library acquired the Records of the Behind the Veil Oral History Project from the Duke University Center for Documentary Studies in 1997, 1998, 2000, and 2002.

Rights:

Limited Re-Use

CC BY-NC 4.0

Rights Note:

Copyright for content created by the Behind the Veil project is held by Duke University and made available to the public using a Creative Commons Attribution / Non-commercial (CC-BY-NC) license.

Identifier:

Interview number: 797
2c4f8533-42a0-4504-a586-1af329e56e08
behindtheveil
btvct07058
ark:/87924/r4959hp5k
422ba741-0708-42b6-aa71-79bb631b6d8f

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Alfred Smith interview recording, 1994 August 02

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1. Alfred Smith administrative file, 1994

John Hope Franklin Research Center

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John Hope Franklin Research Center

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