Johnnie Archie interview recording, 1994 June 17

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Johnnie Archie	Well, you're going to ask question, I answer. Is that right?	0:01
Paul Ortiz	Okay.	0:04
Johnnie Archie	All right.	0:04
Paul Ortiz	Yeah.	0:05
Johnnie Archie	Go ahead.	0:05
Paul Ortiz	Mr. Archie, I wonder if you could tell me a little bit about when you were born and where you were born, and then a little bit about the community that you grew up in.	0:06
Johnnie Archie	I was born in Wilcox County, 1909, on a place my daddy bought a home, a little home, a 80 acres of land. I grew up there, a place you called Lamison, Alabama. It was four boys and two girls, whole brothers and sisters. But my dad was married. Before he was married to my mother, he had a boy and a girl by his wife. My mother was married before she married him. Her husband died and she was the mother of a boy and a girl. So we grew up in that family like that. My daddy bought a home, 80 acres of land in 1908, he paid for it in 1908 or 1909, somewhere along. I think it paid for it the year I was born or the year before I was born.	0:18
Johnnie Archie	We would raise part of our own food. We raised chickens, turkeys, guineas, hogs and cows. We would pickle a cow. My daddy would pickle a cow every year. He would kill enough hog to last practically all of the year. My daddy was a railroad man. He worked for the Southern Railroad Company, on the Mobile division. We raised our food stuff mostly. We raised corn, peas, sweet potatoes, sugar cane, make our own syrup. We even down would raise rice.	1:34
Johnnie Archie	We get a big log, cut down a pine tree and cut it all by four of five feet long and you get a sharp instrument and would dig a place in that log about this deep, but it'd be wide at the top and narrow at the bottom. Sometimes it had to put fire up and then burn it, and we got something you would call a pepper. You'd get you a piece of timber, cut it off about two, three foot long and you'd would trim it on the end and you'd put that rice down in there and you'd jug it like that with that, we call a pepper to get the husk out of it.	2:34
Johnnie Archie	Then after you do that so much, you take the rice out and put your old quilt or spread or something down on the ground and hold it up and the wind but blow the husks out of the rice. So you'd have your rice and the husk would be cleaned off. We'd make our own syrup.	3:33
Johnnie Archie	So we had a good life. We didn't have no silver spoon in our mouth, but didn't nobody have to advance my daddy. A whole lot of people live near us. That man had a family. He'd work for wages. He was making $120 a year, $10 a month. I don't see how he did it, but he did.	3:56
Johnnie Archie	After I went to elementary school and had to go a long ways then to high school. I had to go from Lamison to Arlington to go high school. That was about eight miles. Last two years that I was in high school, I rode a bicycle from Lamison to Anne Manie. That was about seven or eight miles.	4:23
Johnnie Archie	Some railroad train used to leave Flatwood, it was three miles from Flatwood in Lamison, five miles from Lamison to Arlington. And some mornings when the train would leave Flatwood, drove across and I'd leave Lamison. The train run eight miles I'd be on the road five miles on the wheel that was going. And there wasn't no asphalt road, it was gravel road.	5:02
Johnnie Archie	So I come up, I didn't have a silver spoon in my mouth but it was kind of rough back there. I started to work before I was of age. I started working by about 14, 15 years of age. We'd lay-by our crops. I'd go to the mill, Frost & Sibley Lumber Company.	5:28
Paul Ortiz	What town was that in?	5:52
Johnnie Archie	That was in 1926, 1927.	5:53
Paul Ortiz	And that was in Wilcox County?	6:03
Johnnie Archie	In Wilcox County, yeah. Lamison in Wilcox County.	6:05
Paul Ortiz	Do you remember when you were growing up, your neighbors, the community, what it was like, or the kind of friends you might have had when you were growing up? Can you talk a little bit about that?	6:11
Johnnie Archie	Yeah. We had friends. Boys, girls who grew up. We didn't fight and carry on like the children carry on now. Our neighbors all felt like we were cousins or kinfolks. We treated one another like that. We was raised up with a bunch of boys. A lady, Miss Mag Gaston had five or six boys. It was six of us. Sam Moe had five or six boys. Johnny Stockman had four, five boys and girls. Well, it's just a crew. It was just a crew then.	6:26
Johnnie Archie	We all raised cows. We'd milk four and five cows all through the summer and spring. Some of those people didn't even have cows. I remember one family, the Stockman family and my mother would churn every day about 11 o'clock. She had a boy named Amos, girl named Bamer and one named Lily. One or two of those kids would come to our house every day at churning time and get a eight pound bucket of milk. We used to get lard in eight pound buckets and then take them buckets and wash them, make them for milk buckets.	7:15
Johnnie Archie	We grew up nice. We didn't have no silver spoon in our mouth, but wages was cheap back then. When I started to work, I started working for the Sibley Lumber Company. I really don't know what the pay was right then and there, but after I got up to be above 18 years of age, I started working for the Southern Railroad. Think I was making $3 or $2,84 I believe. That's what it was, $2,84. Worked six months, got a raise.	8:01
Paul Ortiz	How did you get that first job at Southern Railroad?	8:50
Johnnie Archie	Well, I had worked at the sawmill and planter mill before I worked on railroad. But that sawmill burned down in 1928. Then I went to the railroad. In fact, my daddy was working on the railroad. He vouched for me.	8:54
Paul Ortiz	Okay, so he helped you?	9:12
Johnnie Archie	He helped me get on. It wasn't hard for me to get on the railroad.	9:15
Paul Ortiz	So he was working both on the railroad and farming?	9:18
Johnnie Archie	Yeah. We run the farm, my dad didn't have to.	9:24
Paul Ortiz	So you had brothers and sisters who were helping out?	9:27
Johnnie Archie	Yeah. I had three, four brothers older than me and they were working different places too. I was working at the mill. I had one brother worked on, he went to the Bridge Gang. The one boy I'm next to, Colin, he worked on Bridge Gang. So after sawmill burned down 1928, that's when I started working on railroad.	9:29
Paul Ortiz	Oh, 1928?	9:58
Johnnie Archie	Mm-hmm.	9:58
Paul Ortiz	Did your family go to church in Wilcox County?	10:03
Johnnie Archie	Did we? Oh, yeah.	10:06
Paul Ortiz	Which church?	10:08
Johnnie Archie	Mount Olive. Mount Olive Primitive Baptist Church. My daddy was what they used to call the head deacon then. They called it the chairman now, churches now. Yeah. Mount Olive.	10:10
Paul Ortiz	Was church an important part of your life?	10:31
Johnnie Archie	Huh?	10:33
Paul Ortiz	Was church an important part of your life growing up?	10:34
Johnnie Archie	Yeah.	10:36
Paul Ortiz	What kinds of activities did you do in the church?	10:36
Johnnie Archie	In the church? Boy, I didn't do anything back then when I was young, but just would attend church. Sung in the choir. Later got to the superintendent Sunday school that I grew up. And that's all I did there at church, after which I got cut off on railroad, I went back to build a mill then about 15 miles from where I lived. Build a mill in Gaston, Alberta. The same company, Frost & Sibley. And in '33, '31, '32, I worked for them for 10 hours, 50 cents a day. I said 45 cents for five days and 50 for one because it's cutting 25 cents a week per inch. Today you don't know nothing about Roosevelt, do you? President Roosevelt, you heard about him?	10:40
Paul Ortiz	Oh yeah.	11:54
Johnnie Archie	Well, the day President Roosevelt was elected I put five stacks of two by 12s through a resolve, through a machinery. Five stacks of two by 12s for 50 cents per day. I made $12 a month taking home $11, back in '32, '33, along there. Well, when that mill cut out—	11:55
Paul Ortiz	What town was that mill in?	12:29
Johnnie Archie	That was 1932 and '33, along in there.	12:29
Paul Ortiz	Okay. And then which town was that?	12:34
Johnnie Archie	Was in Alberta where that mill was. Well, the same company was in Lamison but they got burned down in '28. In '31, '32 they moved to a place called Alberta about 15 miles beyond me and built back. I worked for them there. And after, what happened? Their sawmill got burned down there. I don't know whether it's in '34 or '35.	12:37
Johnnie Archie	But anyway, I remember '38, '39, I went to Jackson, Alabama. That's about 50 miles going towards Mobile. I worked for Smith Lumber Company, then I work for Bale Lumber Company in Jackson, Alabama. In the latter part of '39 I worked for Calvin Construction Company on the highway. That's along the last part of '39 and '40. I worked back with Moss and Wilkerson Lumber company in '40 and the early part of '41.	13:12
Paul Ortiz	Moss and Wilson?	14:30
Johnnie Archie	Moss and Wilson. Mm-hmm.	14:32
Paul Ortiz	What was it like working back then in those companies? What were some of your experiences? What were your thoughts?	14:36
Johnnie Archie	I got to take this off, man. Right. Now, what did you—	14:44
Paul Ortiz	What was it like working for the different companies? What were some of your experiences? You were moving—	14:58
Johnnie Archie	What were my duties?	15:06
Paul Ortiz	What was it like to work there? You had moved from Wilcox.	15:10
Johnnie Archie	No, I still was at Wilcox.	15:15
Paul Ortiz	Okay, you're at Wilcox?	15:17
Johnnie Archie	I was still at Wilcox. The way we would transport from Lamison to Alberta was to go on truck by and far. And then after which I went to room and boarding in Alberta. I got scared to travel. Something got to bother me, I don't know what it was. One morning I had to leave home by 4:30 to catch truck by five o'clock. Going up the road one morning, something like, I don't know what it was. Wasn't no wind blowing nowhere and trees was on the side of the road. It looked like a windstorm would be in like this tree and leave about four apartments here, that house yonder.	15:18
Johnnie Archie	Get there, it would be in that. Just look like something up there shaking the limbs and leaves off, but it wouldn't be in but one tree. Leave that I'd go—you know like trees on side of the road, all that from here to Avenue apartments. So forth like that. That kind of stagnated me.	16:10
Johnnie Archie	Later had a new way I could go across and not hit the public road. I had a new road we could go across. One evening I got in 5:30 in the evening, in the fall, the sun is about down. We get off 5:30, ride 15 miles, then I'd get out and walk a mile and a half. Going through skid of wood one night, I see something there, I don't know what it was. Whatever it was, it jumped, it was on the tree. Stopped along by there. It just went and made scratching but wasn't moving. I got jubies about that. I didn't know what in the world that was.	16:36
Johnnie Archie	I carried a gun, I fired at the thing and it fell off on the exploding of the gun, even though it made a reflection, I could see it looked like it fell off the tree, but it didn't make no noise, I didn't hear no noise.	17:28
Johnnie Archie	Went back long there the next morning or two and I heard a voice, something called me. There was a graveyard above where I was going. I don't know whether nobody's up there or not. They called me by my nickname. They called my nickname was Bubba. I didn't say anything and then I had made up my mind, if it called again I was going to answer. I got jubies, a little shake up. I said, "Well, I ain't going to take these chances no more." That's when I went to stay up to Alberta.	17:48
Johnnie Archie	Well, that was long about, I don't know what year it was. I don't know what year it was, but it was after '34, '35, along there. But after which then I went to working on the highway with construction work building bridges with Calvin Construction Company.	18:21
Paul Ortiz	Did you always carry a rifle with you back in those days?	18:57
Johnnie Archie	No I didn't. I'd carry a gun sometimes. Pocket gun, 38 sometimes when I was going back and forth to work like that. But just to carry it up and down the streets, one thing I didn't carry. I carried when I was going back and forth to work sometime.	19:00
Paul Ortiz	Was there any reason? Was it for protection that you carried a gun?	19:14
Johnnie Archie	That's what it was for, protection. For a while, especially when I was going leaving home full day and getting back at night. It'd be day when I leave and day when I come back.	19:22
Paul Ortiz	Were you thinking about self-defense?	19:37
Johnnie Archie	Yeah, that's all it was for. That didn't last long because I didn't travel like that too long. I went to boarding after all that things shook me up. That's the reason I went to carrying it. It got me shook up. I didn't know what that was. I didn't know whether somebody in there trying to harass me or what it was. So to keep from getting in trouble, if it was, I decided I'd just quit, go boarding. That's what I did.	19:39
Paul Ortiz	Was there any kind of racial violence?	20:12
Johnnie Archie	Then, no.	20:16
Paul Ortiz	In Wilcox County?	20:17
Johnnie Archie	No, no. Wasn't no violence. Wasn't no racial violence during them years. Hardly ever you would hear tell of any kind of thing breaking out. As far as family relationship, we didn't have no kind of violence between families back then. People got along like they were sisters and brothers. What my dad and mother had, they would—Like we kill hog, kill a beef thing like that, they divided with the neighbors. They had some what, green teas and things like that we'd raise. They divided, we'd divide it with the neighbors. You're going have some lazy folk, I don't care where you're going, how you do. Some folk didn't. We didn't have a silver spoon in our mouth but my daddy taught us to work. We always had something to share. Always had something to share.	20:18
Johnnie Archie	So after working on this railroad in 1939 and '40, I got tired of this concrete building bridges and things. It was working on my eyes. So that work had got slow anyway and I started back working the mill. And me and one little boy used to stack every bit of the lumber. We'd cut down 35, 40,000 feet lumber a day. 35, sometimes 45,000. Me and one fellow would stack all of that. They wasn't paying us nothing. $2 I think or $2,75. We asked for a raise. I asked them to give us that as a contract. We were stacking it, putting it all through the dry kiln.	21:21
Johnnie Archie	So I told my buddy, I said, "I'm tired of this. They don't want to give us a raise and don't want to look like do nothing for us." I said, "I'm going to Birmingham." That was on Saturday evening I told him that. Friday evening, we made it up. Thursday and Friday or something like that. But we worked to Saturday evening, I said, "I'm going to Birmingham in the morning." Train running 10:30 coming to Selma and 5:30 going to Mobile. I went board the train come to Birmingham in 1941 in March. He boarded the trained that next evening going to Mobile. So they had to get about 8 men to stack that lumber after we gone.	22:20
Paul Ortiz	To replace two of you?	23:07
Johnnie Archie	Just two of us were doing it. So they quit. Had to put it out on the yard. Made a lot of yard out there in the stack, let it air dry. So I came here in '41.	23:08
Paul Ortiz	Did you have other family or friends that had went to Birmingham before you did?	23:26
Johnnie Archie	Yeah, had a brother-in-law and a nephew, was working for Republic Steel. I come here, I had a nephew, a good ball player. And I was pretty good ball player and they were scouting for ball players. That's how I got the job here.	23:36
Paul Ortiz	At Republic Steel?	24:04
Johnnie Archie	At Republic Steel, yeah. My nephew was playing with the Thomas Company and I played in the city league for a year and a half or two years, in '41 and part of '42. I worked here then. I got hurt in [indistinct 00:24:30] one evening. Fella blocked the bay, made me fall. I hurt my hand and head. I popped up a ball, straight up in air. Never popped the ball like this. When the ball hit the ground I was in second base. That's just how high the ball went in there.	24:05
Johnnie Archie	Fellow mean, looked like he tried to stop me going in third base. Said, well it's time for me to quit. I quit playing ball in '42, before I come to Birmingham in '41 or must have been '39 because I come to Birmingham in March of '41. And in '39 I pitched a game of ball against Muddy Wood in '39.	24:51
Paul Ortiz	Against who?	25:20
Johnnie Archie	Muddy Wood. That's the name of the other team, Muddy Wood in '39. And we win that game. And I come here and I've been here ever since. Been here since '41. I got a job, Republic Steel, what happened, their labor foreman down here, he used to work for Southern Railroad on Rome, Georgia division out of Aniston going towards Rome, Georgia. I worked over there a while after I had to cut off at home and I bumped to Rome, Georgia division and worked there for a while. And come behold the yard master was over there, was a personnel man here when I come here.	25:21
Johnnie Archie	He asked my nephew when he carried my name down there. He told my nephew, said, "Yeah, tell him come in." He hadn't forgotten me. So when I walked in, the personnel officer that morning down in the labor department office, he told the personnel man to hire me. So when I went to the labor department that morning, and he spoke and I spoke, "You look like I know you." He said, "I know you." I said, "Where you know me from?" He laughed. I said, "I know who you are. Your name Mr. Sim," he was a yard master over in Rome, Georgia division. I've been working here, I work here ever since then.	26:11
Johnnie Archie	I started to work here on 23rd day of March, 1941. I worked 32 years, 10 months and six days. I was late one time during that time. I had to go to a trial. I called the foreman and so I said, they hadn't called for me yet. He said, "Well, when you get out, you come in." About 4:30 when I got here. I retired in 31st January in '73. I was off during that time one day and a piece for illness. I strained a muscle around my heart one morning pushing on lead, coming by the doctor office and told me that's what I did.	26:53
Johnnie Archie	Got ready to go back to work that night. I was working 11:00 to 7:00. I had a chill, had my wife who pulled me off. Next day I went back, went back work and that's the time I lose. 32 years and 10 months, six days is what I put in Republic Steel. I ain't did nothing but work hard all my days. Treat everybody due respect.	27:48
Paul Ortiz	What was it like going from Wilcox County to Birmingham in 1941? Was it a big change for you as a young man moving to Birmingham?	28:12
Johnnie Archie	Yes, it was a big change. I had got tired of working for nothing. Then I had got tired of working piece jobs and work a while, eight or 10 months here, five or six months here and and then cut out. I was on my way to West Virginia but I didn't want to mine. My brother was working in a mine, and my nephew was working for this company. He's ball player and they're scouting for ball players. I a pretty good ball player and that's what helped me get a job here and so I settled, stop here. I stayed here. That's why. That's I come. I got tired of it.	28:30
Johnnie Archie	I still got a home down there now. I fly down on Wednesday. Got 80 acres of land there my daddy left. Fella tried to buy it, so ain't for sale. 80 acres of land there. I've been what's his name, folks men going in there and them four wheel drivers, kept the road all messed up. I put up some poster sign there this past October.	29:11
Paul Ortiz	What part of Birmingham did you live in?	29:40
Johnnie Archie	Right here.	29:42
Paul Ortiz	Right here?	29:43
Johnnie Archie	Right here.	29:44
Paul Ortiz	In this area?	29:44
Johnnie Archie	Right here in this house.	29:45
Paul Ortiz	In this house?	29:49
Johnnie Archie	I stayed in this house from August of '41. I moved my family here in December the seventh, the day they bombed Pearl Harbor. I had three girls and five boys. Raised them right here. Put them all through good schools. They never went to college.	29:51
Paul Ortiz	What was this neighborhood like in 1941? Who lived here? Was this mainly African-American people that lived in this area?	30:19
Johnnie Archie	Yeah. From this street back here, Third Street, back this way, back to Ninth Street was all Colored people. From Third Street back that way, they were a White settlement. Now all these houses, them houses right down across the avenue—	30:33
Paul Ortiz	Across Florida Avenue?	31:03
Johnnie Archie	Across Florida Avenue built since I was here. That house there was built since I been here. That house over there was built since I been here. The rest of these houses from here back to Ninth Street was company housing. Years ago they sold them to the employees back in—what, the fifties? Somewhere in the fifties or sixties. Somewhere. I don't know. I can't remember exactly what year it was. Had to be in the fifties, something. 50-something because them were built down there in the sixties, in 50-something when they sold them. The company sold them to the employees.	31:04
Paul Ortiz	Republic Steel?	32:09
Johnnie Archie	Yeah.	32:10
Paul Ortiz	What was it like to live here? You said it was basically a company town.	32:14
Johnnie Archie	Yeah, company housing.	32:22
Paul Ortiz	Company housing. What was it like?	32:23
Johnnie Archie	You mean the neighborhood or something?	32:28
Paul Ortiz	Yeah, the neighborhood. Where did you go shopping?	32:30
Johnnie Archie	Well, you'd go to town to shop, go to Birmingham to shop. Well, the company had a big store, something called a commissary. We would buy goods, buy food from the company store. They had something like doogaloo. You could get a order and you go to the office and you check out whatever you wanted to check out. You spend it like you do money, but it was a company doogaloo. Called it doogaloo. You have quarters, dimes and half a dollar and things, but I don't what that stuff was named on that thing. But you couldn't spend it it nowhere but with the company.	32:40
Paul Ortiz	Like script?	33:34
Johnnie Archie	Yeah, like script. Some called it script, some called it doogaloo. I would buy three sets of clothes a year. I would buy for Christmas, Easter and September for school time. Like I buy for Christmas, by Easter I'd be paid that out, just about. They'd cut me so much a month. Sometime I'll buy well eight or $900 worth of clothes. Clothes and things wasn't selling like they sell now. But that's the way I schooled my children. Buy their school clothes, buy for Christmas for them, and buy for Easter for them. Well, Christmas time I'd be about paid it out for Easter. By Easter time I'd be paid that out for school time.	33:36
Johnnie Archie	But they were cutting me so much per month or so much or estimate. We had estimates, pay off on fourth or 19th where the estimate run. And that's the way I paid for my children clothes. The company allowed me to—All down here you can see them houses down there? I used to raise peas and beans, corn down here. Cross that road over there where you come in, that's where I learned my children how to work. I raised peanut, sweet potatoes, peas and beans there.	34:51
Johnnie Archie	Folks did me bad, did me bad there. I had 18 rows of corn go down from this Fourth Street, that Fifth Street down here and Fifth Street go across railroad down here like that railroad across up there. I had 18 rows of corn. I had bought me a hall and a grain. I rode over the field one evening to see how it looked. Got over there and somebody had pulled 18 rows of the corn, pulled it all and had got all the piles but two.	35:29
Johnnie Archie	I come back home, got my double-barrel shotgun and went and sit on a stump between them two piles. My good mind and bad mind wrestling and warfaring. I was going to shoot anybody who come pick up that corn. I had three girls, five boys to take care of and raise, and they did me like that. But my good mind overruled. I throw the gun over my shoulder, 12 o'clock at night, 11 o'clock and come on to the house.	36:04
Johnnie Archie	Another time I had some shoats over there on that old road. That was an old road then. Wasn't nobody traveling. I had five shoats in there and somebody was trying to take out. Several fellow had hog pens over there. Somebody went to taking them and we took time out at night and watched. One night I was laying on a poplar tree. Guy walked up to the pen. I had five shoats in there. He raised up his feet. I had made a platform where my children could put feed over in the thing. He raised up his feet to put over in the pen. He raised up like this. Instead of putting it over the pen, he took it down, put it by me way. I thumb cocked a 38 coat. He put his foot down, walked away. I met my buddy across the thing there. That was on, I don't know whether it was on Thursday night or Friday night.	36:39
Johnnie Archie	But anyway, Saturday morning or Monday morning, I don't remember which, I backed my truck up to. I had a little truck. I backed up and put all five of them on and came back to the house. I said if I got anything I got to get in trouble about, I don't want it. Keep getting in trouble. I left. I went and sold them. Had a milk cow. Had a little bull. I raised them. I learned them how to plow. Folks used to off road and make pictures of me. Learned my children how to work and ain't none of my kid lazy. All of them work. That's how I did raise my children. They thought I was mean talking about learn how to work, but I know they wasn't going to be on my shoulder always.	37:38
Johnnie Archie	So I went through it rough. I was treated bad on the way here, but thank God I made it. Had another field over there. Somebody went away and shelled the corn over there. Pulled all the—	38:20
Paul Ortiz	Shelled?	38:32
Johnnie Archie	Shelled it instead of went and pulled it and shelled it. I worked hard here. I used to work at night, 3:00 to 11:00. Work at seven o'clock, get off three o'clock, go right back at 11:00 to 7:00.	38:35
Paul Ortiz	What kind of job were you doing at Republic Steel?	38:56
Johnnie Archie	Well, I first started working on the railroad. I worked on the railroad for a while in the yard. Then I went to work track walking, putting the engines in the cars on the track when they get off. I did that for about three years for '44, '45. '44 I believe it was. I went to the coal half and went to the dry product where they make coke oven. I started working on the coke oven around '45, '47, somewhere along there. Worked hard at it.	38:59
Johnnie Archie	I wanted a job where they didn't lay off, where it didn't get too cold and didn't get too hot. And that's where I got a job at. I worked on the coke oven 26 years some. When I retire, I retired from the coke oven, a larryman. I worked everywhere around there. I worked the wood mill, I worked at coal handling. I worked loot, a leadman, then I retired larryman. I was a larryman when I left.	39:38
Paul Ortiz	When you were working in the railroad yard, you said that the engines would—	40:10
Johnnie Archie	Get off track.	40:16
Paul Ortiz	Get off the track. How would you get them back on the track?	40:18
Johnnie Archie	With re-railers and wood, stuff like that.	40:20
Paul Ortiz	How many people were on that job, would be on there?	40:27
Johnnie Archie	On there?	40:29
Paul Ortiz	Yeah.	40:29
Johnnie Archie	A track walker?	40:29
Paul Ortiz	Yeah.	40:29
Johnnie Archie	Me only. Then the switchman and the conductors and the fireman thing would get down and help me if I had to have a tie. See, we had some re-railers, it's called a re-railer. Just like the train jumped the track on this side, you had something that had flans in it. It was about this big, this long. It'd start little down here and then it'd raise up. When you get up to the top of it, it'd slip over on down the rail. You'd have one on each side. And you spike them down where they wouldn't slip to the tire. Get in there and put steam to it and get a little engine and pull them up. This wheeler drop on on, come on, drop on it there for you. It was funny to do but it was either I have dug out ice and snow and everything. Got out on the ground to put them re-railers down.	40:30
Johnnie Archie	I seen my death two times up there. They had a cinder plant there where they make that cinder. 75, 80, 85, sometimes 90% iron. They burned coal dust, pyrite, and what all they didn't mix in that thing? But when it go through that processor of heat, it would come out pyrite, coal, so forth, so on. They had five or six different mixes they'd put in there. When they go in there, it'd go in there like powder. But when it come out it'd be center. Go through a process of heat, burn it and when it come out it'll come out in the process of iron, about 75, 85% iron.	41:53
Johnnie Archie	I was putting on the car that one night down on across the re-railer. Well, you didn't have much space to drive a spike. Sometime my maul would hit the top of the car. Got the re-railer put down, wait until the engine come and the door broke down right where I was sitting across the rail. It'd amassed me flatter than this thing, about 7500 tons in the car.	42:38
Johnnie Archie	Another night I was putting on car super rock, or not super rock. Flue dust, that's come out in furnaces. The dust in furnace, that dust would come over down and stuff, it'd be red hot. I putting a car that one night, door broke down where the furnace had blow through and blow coke breeze out in the yard. That stuff was so hot. It'd run on the ground, you take a wall and dash it. I run and what saved me was I jumped across the railroad. The railroad track, when you got the railroad track, you just run up and couldn't jump over there, some pile up against the railroad track and spread it like that.	43:10
Johnnie Archie	Another evening, I was putting on a car, dolomite, that rock that dig out—They got rock down there they would put in there to make iron too. Lime rock, I guess that's what it was. I was putting on car that one evening. Put re-railer down, waiting on them to come to give me a pull. Door broke down there. I stand and look. My rabbit got out of the bed then. I left the transportation department. That's what made me leave, come to the [indistinct 00:44:36].	44:01
Johnnie Archie	I have taken one man and put her in the stock rail at night. Go to the railroad, go to the rail pile, 39 foot rail, it weighed about 110 pounds to the foot. I had took one man and went to rail pile and I put a rail on the push car and go put 10 with one man help. Boy, I've done some hard work in my life, but I got pledge I'd done it then. I had to work. That rock pile was so hot that you'd have to get back, you'd have to put on wooden shoes on the bottom of your shoes to stay on top of that coke oven. You'd have to wear wooden shoes.	44:36
Johnnie Archie	And then when them drags would come out, I worked on the front for years. When them drags would come out when you push that coke out of there, sometimes them drags would be that high. I don't see how I did it. I started quitting. I told the man one day, I said, "Going further than I can go." They didn't want you to throw it on the ground, they wanted you to throw it all back in the oven. I throwing something back in the oven and burned, the shell got so crumped up I had to hit it down on the concrete to straighten it out and then let it sit there while it cooled.	45:29
Johnnie Archie	One day the foreman told me I throwing it on the ground. He said, "The boss don't want you to throw it. Don't throw no more of that on the ground." When you get hot you get mad. I said, "It's too hot for the boss to sit in the office without a fan." I said, "This here, I throw it in his lap." I kept throwing it on the ground. I went up to the thing, told a man, I said, "You can give me a out card. I'm through." I said, "This coal here stand up and you know how bad it stand up." He said, "Go out and cool off. Go out and sit down." Said, "I'm through. You can give me a out card." I was mad and dissatisfied.	46:08
Johnnie Archie	He come back when I cool off and he say, "Let me talk to you. I want to talk to you." He said, "I know it's rough." He said, "It ain't going to be like this always. These oven ain't going to tear up like this all the time." He say, "You got a family." Said, "I know you can get another job. I believe you can get another job, but you think what would it would cost you."	46:47

Johnnie Archie	And I paid attention to what he said. I got to thinking, "Yeah, I could get another job somewhere." I had an employed job for Farmer Railroad. So I got to thinking, "You got to get up and you got to transfer and so forth and so on." For my children, I had five kids in school, going to high school. I could get a book of tickets, cost—What? I don't even know. But anyway, street car fare was 7 cents from here to town. But going to school you got a little deduction by buying school tickets. I don't remember what them school tickets were, but it was less than 14 cents per day. It was less than 14 cents per day for the children to ride to school. If you got school ticket. So I'd buy a book of tickets, they would last—I don't know, I think last a week or month. I don't know. I just remember how long it would last. It was rough.	0:05
Paul Ortiz	On the jobs that you were working on when you were doing rerailing, working at coke ovens, were you primarily working with other Black workers?	1:25
Johnnie Archie	Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. All of them was Black but the patcher and the foreman. The patchers and the patcher hippers were White. The foremans was White. The larryman, well the pusher was White at the time. The looters, the leadman were all Colored up until a period of time, up until after '65. After the civil right come in. After the civil right come in, we was belonged to the CIO Union. If a job come open, if you had the age, you could apply for it. So that started us to running the pusher and the door machine.	1:36
Johnnie Archie	Well, the door machine was a Colored all the time, but the pusher was White. Door cleaners was Colored until a period of time. After civil rights come in, then we could apply for the up job, machine job. But before civil rights come in, we didn't have no machine job. We were allowed on the machine. I learned how to operate a machine by—My buddy, was a White guy. He lived back here behind me. And me and him was working the door machine together. I was on the floor throwing in the drags and knocking the truck doors over where he could live.	2:46
Johnnie Archie	Then I learned to—I'd go up there and watch him with those controls and I learned how to push. But we as Colored folk wasn't allowed on the machinery. All right? When it come time for us to bump and go to the machinery with our ages, we know how to operate them. They didn't have to cover us. So White foreman called me one night to come out to run the hot car. Somebody left. He said, "I can't tell you nothing to do. But the quenching station up here and they walk right here. All I can tell you." That was something you—A machine that you caught the coal after pusher push it out and catch it and carry it to the quenching station. Quench it out, put it out.	3:37
Johnnie Archie	I worked everywhere there, I work the mud mill, looting, door machine, pusher, leadman, screener, I worked everywhere there.	4:28
Paul Ortiz	What did the leadman do?	4:43
Johnnie Archie	Leadman. That's a machineman that would go to the top house and get the coal. It had four hoppers. Each one of them hoppers would hold 13 tons or 14 tons. Something like that. No it didn't. Wasn't that much. That's what would come out. That's what would come out when it push the thing out. How many tons of that thing would hold?	4:49
Johnnie Archie	Where you provide four by 14 ton, hit a pusher out by 14 ton coal. Then we had four hoppers. That was a fan made on the coke oven. It had a submariner like this thing made like this company that [indistinct 00:05:37] could drop it down over them charging hold.	5:13
Johnnie Archie	When the larryman pull a coal out, we would have to be there to sweep the coal in and then put the lead on. Then you have mud and loot. You make up a solution of mud and make it out water and coals. So for to pour around in them cracks to keep the smoke in. We did them machine them those things—They had to loop them though with mud and for dry goods you had a thing bar made like on long ham made this way. You go down iron that—And keep smoking. You didn't lose no smoke. Boy. Yeah, I went through, went through. I went through it right.	5:42
Paul Ortiz	You mentioned the CIO union?	6:31
Johnnie Archie	Yeah.	6:40
Paul Ortiz	What union was that?	6:40
Johnnie Archie	That's CIO. That was the union. That's the name of it.	6:40
Paul Ortiz	Was that the United Steelworker?	6:44
Johnnie Archie	Yeah.	6:45
Paul Ortiz	Okay.	6:46
Johnnie Archie	That's what it was. CIO. That's what they first named it. So after which they name brought it in the United Steelworker, but I think that's a real name of the United Steelworker of America.	6:48
Paul Ortiz	And what year did you join that?	6:59
Johnnie Archie	In '42 I believe. '43. '42, '43. Somewhere along—Yeah, we had to do that. Trying to get organized. You'd have to do that on the QT. We had to do that on QT for the company to find out you was trying to help out that thing. They didn't want to fight. So our president, he was an engineer man and his vice president was—He worked at the VP building. I carried notes to the president many times. Being a track walker, I carried notes many times. Slipped me notes many times to catch it—President.	7:02
Paul Ortiz	So you were in a key position?	7:53
Johnnie Archie	Yeah.	7:56
Paul Ortiz	What kind of notes would you carry?	7:57
Johnnie Archie	I don't know what would be on a lot of time. He'd tell when the meeting—What business was. I wouldn't read the note. Yeah. It would be our union business. It'd be union business. That's where it would be when set up, where it going to meet at sometime before they got all of them. That when they're getting set up before the organized—Got organized.	8:00
Paul Ortiz	And when you pass the notes to the other members or the other workers?	8:20
Johnnie Archie	No, I'd take them to the president. From vice president sometimes to the president, like that secretary and so forth and so on.	8:26
Paul Ortiz	And where were they at?	8:36
Johnnie Archie	Well they'd be on their job. Okay. Well the vice president working at the VP building, the president was engineer man and the secretary, he worked at the powerhouse. So I had some spare time sometime. See track walking in the evening time. I would clean around the switches and clean them out and kept them all. And it would get dark. I wouldn't have nothing to do but wait until some of them get all—Have a rake. Some of them hot parts get off track or a car get off track. They'd call for me. I would be at the roundhouse until then, they made three calls and I know where to go. I know where it was.	8:41
Paul Ortiz	Three calls?	9:29
Johnnie Archie	Yeah. On a whistle. Just like the train get off, he blow three times. I know what to do. That was my signal. I had to go then.	9:34
Paul Ortiz	Go where?	9:41
Johnnie Archie	Go where he was, if he's on track, if he's in north yard, whether he's down on Frisco, wherever he was, he'd get off track. He'd blow. Three blow.	9:42
Paul Ortiz	That was the president?	9:55
Johnnie Archie	No. Yeah, that was him. Sometimes him. But what I'm saying, my job was when them trains and them cars and them hot cars to get off the track. Well the train had to carry the hot cars, the iron from the furnaces to the pig machine. See sometimes they'd get off track. Well that's where they call for me.	9:56
Paul Ortiz	Okay.	10:19
Johnnie Archie	Three blow, three blow. I know what it was. I'd had to go running there sometimes. Yeah. It was rough. It was rough. But I made it. I enjoy—I enjoyed working while I was working. I wasn't no lazy man in no way. So I made—When I go on job, I go on job, do my work. I didn't go on the job to lay down. I unloaded more coal in eight hours in any man had been to—With the company then I didn't know what the setup was.	10:19
Johnnie Archie	One day I could unload another car, unloaded 24 car in eight hour. They had been unloading 20, sometimes 21, 22. Had nobody ever unloaded 24 cars. I'm the only man that unloaded 24 cars in the Coca Cola mill. They loaded 21, 19, 21, and 22 had nobody got up to 23. And I didn't know that they was checking that. So the guy asked me, said "You got time to unload—Unload another car." So I ain't going to do it. See I unload unloaded 24 cars and I would've did it but the bin is running over. I said, "Where can I put it? I got time but the bin running over." So that kept me from unloading 25 cars. Yeah, it was the bin run over. Couldn't hold. It flagged me down.	10:53
Paul Ortiz	Did the—I want ask you just a couple more questions.	11:47
Johnnie Archie	Well as many you want.	11:50
Paul Ortiz	About the union organizing? One question. Do you remember the names of the—You mentioned the president and the treasurer. Do you remember their names?	11:52
Johnnie Archie	God, Mr. Anderson was the first president. Mr. Anderson. What was his first name? I don't know whether it was Roy Anderson, but I know that was his last name. His son live right here, over here on the road. Right below the [indistinct 00:12:26]. The second house to the right. But what his first name was, I don't know. And Emmett Robinson was secretary when they was organized and getting organized.	12:08
Paul Ortiz	And were they Black?	12:42
Johnnie Archie	No, they were White.	12:42
Paul Ortiz	How did you guys—I guess the question I'm trying to ask is how did you get Black and White workers to cooperate to work together?	12:55
Johnnie Archie	Well they worked together. They're like teamwork. See on the, you take it at the coke oven we had a White foreman and a White heater. You had a White pusher, you had a White quenching calmer. The larryman was a Colored, the layering was a Colored, door cleaner was a Colored. And the door machine was Colored. The patchers was White, patcher hippers was White. But we all worked together just like we were. Wasn't no discrimination. We didn't have a big discrimination at all.	13:04
Paul Ortiz	So when you started organizing.	13:58
Johnnie Archie	Organizing, they all come together. Wasn't no, no split. Negros and the White folks come together as one body. Wasn't no discrimination. We had some of them scared, but we had enough that wasn't scared that would bring them in. What was scared. So as we got organized, we got our chart and everything. He was good place away. But beforehand he was pretty rough. And before we got organized, pretty rough.	14:02
Paul Ortiz	So you were able to improve the condition?	14:39
Johnnie Archie	Yeah, it did. The union did. It improved the condition. It wasn't no discrimination amongst the White and the Colored when they were working and after they got organized it wasn't no discrimination. Because when you would—A job would come available. Now they discriminate against me, once.	14:41
Johnnie Archie	I was on the railroad and a switchman job come over and I would, when somebody wouldn't report the work, I'd have to switch. And they hired a fella from the commissary, put him. He didn't know a lining bar from a crowbar.	15:03
Johnnie Archie	But see I had a family. I had to work. So when we went to the—Before the superintendent, he asked me why didn't I make known to him? I said I carried it to the representative as far as I know to carry. Did he treat me low down dirty? I was already experienced fireman then I had learned how to switch when somebody would be off with favoritism. That's what did it. But see what it was. I didn't do too much discrimination because I had a family to work for.	15:22
Johnnie Archie	See what I'm saying? But you see young, then I didn't know like I knowed up in the [indistinct 00:16:10]. If I knowed like I had have knowed up in [indistinct 00:16:10], been a different story, had learn and anything to get in there. You got to learn.	16:03
Paul Ortiz	What was your union local number?	16:15
Johnnie Archie	2382.	16:17
Paul Ortiz	Okay.	16:18
Johnnie Archie	CIO. Won't never forget that. My badge number 270. I won't forget them two things.	16:25
Paul Ortiz	Your membership number?	16:30
Johnnie Archie	I remember my number, 270 was my number. Badge number. That's where I had to go punch my clock. 270. Late one time I had to go to a trial. Then in that 32 years and 10 months and six days, I had to go to a trial. I didn't lay off. I think I lose two days when my mother passed back in '50. Had to go bury her.	16:33
Paul Ortiz	When did you—Moving away, away from work a little bit. Can you tell me about when and where you met your wife?	16:59
Johnnie Archie	Yeah, my wife and I were raised in Fort Paul. We went school together. We went to elementary school together. Me and my wife did.	17:10
Paul Ortiz	When did you get married?	17:32
Johnnie Archie	In '34.	17:33
Paul Ortiz	'34? Did you go to Birmingham by yourself first to look for work?	17:43
Johnnie Archie	Yeah. Yeah. I come by myself. I had a brother-in-law live there on fifth Street and a nephew live there on fifth Street. I come to my brother-in-law house. When I come here to go to work, I come here on Sunday morning. Train got here Sunday evening and I wasn't here for a few days before I went to work.	17:47
Paul Ortiz	When did the rest of your family come up? To Birmingham?	18:18
Johnnie Archie	Well my oldest boy, I went and got him in '41, in September to put him in high school in '41.	18:24
Paul Ortiz	Which high school?	18:34
Johnnie Archie	Parker.	18:36
Paul Ortiz	Parker.	18:36
Johnnie Archie	Parker. In December the seventh. I went and got my family, brought my family here, right here in this house. And we've been living here since.	18:40
Paul Ortiz	What kind of kind of school was Parker?	18:56
Johnnie Archie	Parker. Parker was a high school. High school there now. Still all my kids finished high school in Parker.	18:56
Paul Ortiz	What did you think about Parker?	18:56
Johnnie Archie	Parker's a good school.	18:56
Paul Ortiz	Good school.	18:59
Johnnie Archie	It was, from what I can hear now, it still is but [indistinct 00:19:24]. These schools now ain't what they used to be because the children got so rebellious. Now the children didn't carry [indistinct 00:19:34] pistols to school back then, hardly ever. You did have a few fights but they be fist fight. Because my boy got in a fight one time on the bus. They got in a fight one time, but it wasn't no gun fight. Just fist fight.	18:59
Paul Ortiz	On the bus?	19:54
Johnnie Archie	Yeah, on streetcar.	19:54
Paul Ortiz	On the streetcar.	19:54
Johnnie Archie	On the streetcar. The streetcar. Well streetcar ain't a bus. I don't know where the bus was [indistinct 00:20:12]	19:59
Paul Ortiz	Do you know what caused the fight?	20:11
Johnnie Archie	No, no. I don't know what caused the fight, been so long, been so long. I don't know what caused the fight. No, but they had left school. They wasn't at school. I had never had to carry—I had to carry one of my kids back to school over in Jackson-Olin.That's over Ensley. A boy's taking a trade to brick mason. I had to carry him back to school one day. He got in a fight. Fella had been calling him a—Playing at him and calling him a sissy and he asked him to leave him off and he went to the principal and told the principal boy the boy was calling him names and was trying to feel over him and he wasn't lying to do that. And finally he hit him upside the head with a ruler or something. But anyway, he splitted the head, side of the face. So they principal sent him home and I had to carry back. So I went back that morning and I asked him, did he know what happened? Did he get—You got my boy's story. Did you get the other boy's story?	20:21
Johnnie Archie	He hadn't got the other boy's story. I had taught my kids. I didn't care who else you lie to. Don't lie to me. Tell me the truth, whatever it is. So I asked this boy what happened in front of the superintendent. Then I asked the superintendent, I said, "Did he come to you sometime back or such and such day and such and such a time." I give him the same date and what time where the boy told me what time it was and the date. I said, he told me he come told you this doesn't—So I said, "Did he tell you that such and such a time?" He remembered it. I said, "Well why didn't you check this other boy and find out what the story was before you sent him home?" So he begged me pardon. See what I'm saying? So I'm upholding him wrong. I'm for right. But I don't think you treated him right, either. So that blowed over. It wasn't up to it. It blowed over.	21:41
Johnnie Archie	So they have got in little fights around here. The boys had, I got one boy, he didn't pick no fights and he's very peculiar. He'd play a while and he'd get tired of playing. He had a little rocking chair. He come down and get on porch, rock, go to sleep. Some of them go that bar and then he had a fight. So I couldn't fault him for that. In the way—Another boy was playing at him and wanted to feel over him and calling him a sissy and so forth like that. He didn't go for that. They got the fighting over there on the road. One Christmas they was skating. He had to go to the doctor, the boy did. So the boy dad and I worked for the company. He worked on the furnace and I worked on Coke oven.	22:43
Johnnie Archie	He come around, he asked about how it was. Told him I don't know how it was. I said, "I can tell you what my boy said." I wasn't there. I asked, what did your boy say? What did he tell? He said something different, something. So I called my boy, come in, here Mr. [indistinct 00:24:08] said, want to know how that fight come up? How it start? So he told me what he told him. Boy nicknamed him, called him a sissy. He wanted to feud and he wouldn't lie and told him to go ahead and he wouldn't quitting. So he just boogered him up.	23:38
Paul Ortiz	What would you do for recreation after work?	24:22
Johnnie Archie	I didn't have no recreation then. I would come in and by working day shift I'd go to the field. I had me a field back across the railroad there and over there by that Catholic church. I didn't have no recreation, I didn't have nothing but the work to try to raise my children. Raised a lot of food—To try to raise food stuff for them in the early years. But in the later years I fished and hunt, I fished and hunt. I can show you there—Deer here I got mounted right there and the fish got there in the later years in the '60—From '65, '60, '65. Back this way. That's what I would do. Had my children got up and got them through school. I'd hunt and fish. That was my hobby.	24:33
Paul Ortiz	Would you and your family ever go downtown to around fourth avenue?	25:30
Johnnie Archie	For recreation? No. No. I never did. After which the children would go to some of the recreation places. But I never did. I didn't never have time to go to no recreation till up the later years. Yeah I went to—	25:35
Paul Ortiz	Did your wife also work?	25:54
Johnnie Archie	No, she didn't work. With three girls and five boys was her job and she had the house. She didn't work nowhere. I figured she had a big job then just take care of that family was a big job. No, she didn't work.	25:56
Paul Ortiz	Did you go to a church around here?	26:16
Johnnie Archie	Yeah, I go—I'm assistant pastor. Church around—Mount Haven.	26:18
Paul Ortiz	Mount Haven.	26:24
Johnnie Archie	Mount Haven. 503 5th Street.	26:27
Paul Ortiz	And when did you start going there?	26:31
Johnnie Archie	I joined there in October of 1941. I sung in the choir there for 39 years. Sung in the choir from '41 to '77. Not good while, wasn't it? Yeah.	26:49
Paul Ortiz	So now you're assistant pastor.	27:00
Johnnie Archie	Yeah, out here, Mount Haven. Helped build two churches.	27:03
Paul Ortiz	Which churches?	27:13
Johnnie Archie	Helped build two.	27:13
Paul Ortiz	Okay.	27:14
Johnnie Archie	When we come here, the company had had a church there and they gave it to the folks here. It was a wood church, tore it down, build a rocks church and cooperated in '65 I believe. And to build a new church in '80. We had 15 years, we paid for it in eight years, less than eight years. 200—Around $200,000.	27:16
Paul Ortiz	When the civil rights, you talked earlier about the civil rights, when the civil rights movement was going on in Birmingham, Dr. King, some of the protests. What did you think about that whole event? The civil rights movement?	27:57
Johnnie Archie	I think it was necessary, but although I didn't have any parts of it, I didn't march, I didn't go to either one of the demonstrations because I was working all the time. But I think it was a necessary thing because we was treated like dogs. Negroes was, we wasn't allowed to drink out of certain fountains. You had to ride the back of the bus if you rode. You couldn't go to—Well certain hotels you could go to. You couldn't go to any hotel you wanted to go to. You had a certain hotel that you could go to, but these hotels was up kept, you couldn't go to them. Your Negro wasn't allowed there. In other words I just tell you the truth, I think that all had been happened from years ago, years back. Because Negro was treated very brutal back then.	28:21
Paul Ortiz	What about here in Thomas? Were there areas in this area that were segregated?	29:46
Johnnie Archie	No. No. They wasn't segregated but they didn't mix like they do now. The White didn't treat you then like they do now. We always did treat them better than they treated us all the time down through the years. But since the civil right thing come about it draw the White and the Negro closer together. So they still have their church and we still have ours, they come to our church to vote. They come to our church sometime they have different meetings or the—What they call it, anticipation meetings. They comes there to have that. So they are—Whites and the Color gets along. They're like sister and brothers now.	29:55
Paul Ortiz	They come to your church?	31:09
Johnnie Archie	Yeah, they come not far—Sometime for, we have a few coming for service but not too often.	31:10
Paul Ortiz	What kinds of people? Retired steel workers or—	31:19
Johnnie Archie	What, here?	31:23
Paul Ortiz	Yeah.	31:25
Johnnie Archie	Yeah. Most of them been retired. We got some people moved in since the civil right all the way down this three here across Florida Avenue. Well was a whole lot of them was in here. Because some of them moved in here in the sixties.	31:25
Paul Ortiz	I wanted to ask you maybe a couple more questions about your childhood that I did not ask earlier. And one of the questions is, do you remember your grandparents much stories that they might have told you?	31:49
Johnnie Archie	About their life or something?	32:11
Paul Ortiz	About their life, about what it was like when grew up? Did they ever talk with you?	32:12
Johnnie Archie	Not very much. I didn't remember nobody but my daddy's mama and my mother's mama. I didn't know anything about my granddaddy on my mother's side or all on my daddy's side. My grandmother was on my daddy's side. I heard her say that she was shipped here from England. She got a whole lot of learning from the—She didn't work in the fields, she stayed at the master's house. That's when took care of his house and his, that's the way she learned how to read and write at their house. And my mama—My mama's daddy, she was a half Indian, I heard her say that.	32:25
Johnnie Archie	And my grand mama on my mama's side, she used to wash and iron for the White people to make her a living. My mama, my grandmama on my daddy's side. I was very small when she died. I was big enough to go make her morning to make her coffee and help her like that. When she passed. My mom, my mother's mother lived long time. I used to go visit her and stay with her three and four days sometime a week at the time. And I used to go with her to get wood to make fire run apart while she washed in iron for some White folk. So that's what—That's all I know about my grandparent. I didn't know anything too much about other than that.	33:32
Paul Ortiz	When you were growing up, if you got sick or got in bad health, where would you go?	34:44
Johnnie Archie	Well my aunt on my daddy's side, she's a midwife. Two of them was and my grandmother on my daddy's side was a midwife. My mother got a good bunch of schooling and we would get sick. Didn't use home remedies thing for, we had a doctor. I didn't—	34:57
Johnnie Archie	I got sick one time in 1919, I had a brother went to the army and he come back. Something broke out, the disease they call it the fluenza. And that spread it all over the country. I had the fluenza when I about nine years old I got so weak.	35:29
Johnnie Archie	Until one morning my mother had moved the bed from back in the house and moved—Didn't have nothing like no gas heat, nothing like that. We had a fireplace, moved up near the fireplace and I went to get up one morning and fell across the fireplace. She was in the kitchen. I don't know what she heard her but when she come down, I was coal scorched. I was too weak to move, if I had have been, I'd have burned up.	35:54
Johnnie Archie	She knew a whole lot of home remedy. That's what we knew. A lot of home remedies you take when we'd have bad cold, you'd get some castor oil, get some lemons. Make tea out of those lemons and give you those castor oil. Get some tallow, put it on a flannel cloth and scorch this cloth. If you had a chest cold and put that flannel into your breast. Tie a bib around it and that flannel laid to your breast, a towel on it. Sure. Use some turpentine—stick a nail in your foot or anything, get some turpentine Pinetop and smoke it, with that Pinetop. Put turpentine on and go about your business. You know might know lockjaw shots and go in the doctor with no lockjaw shots and one thing, another stick a nail in feet.	36:18
Johnnie Archie	Get some turpentine. Go get some pine top. You know what pine top is? You know what a pine tree is? Well you go get some of them leaves. All them pine top and I'll get your old bucket or something that you could set a fire. Let smoke, put some turpentine on. Hold that place over, that fire, over that smoke and go about your business.	37:26
Johnnie Archie	Home remedy. What they do, hollybush tea so forth and so on. Worms, for children, get some horehound candy, turpentines and then worms get to choking. Kids you know about children be full of worms, get you turpentine and mark from here down to his naval and then stick your hand turpentine mark around the naval. Them worms going to turn loose. Yes sir.	37:54
Johnnie Archie	Yeah, we didn't have no doctor. Had a doctor. Didn't have doctor. Told my mama about 18, 78 year old I slept with [indistinct 00:38:36]. Told I didn't have, didn't have an operate on. I wasn't going to live. I had to make a decision for myself. I wouldn't have an operation. I couldn't digest nothing since I've been here. But I lived through it. Yes, home remedies. That's what we did. What we did. Now look at all messed that that's, that's cough right there. That's Creole mustard. That's one—I have pains in my leg. Look at what I have. Look lineament, this here lineament, what's name all kinds of—Then I had salve and everything. Look, here's some salve. I had to get up my robe last night. Legs, what it is. Cramps. So it's just one those thing we go—I got doctor prescription now. Went last year, got some pills there. Bitter. I thought I had a symptom of sugar but I didn't have no sugar.	38:25
Paul Ortiz	What was medical care like when you moved here?	39:32
Johnnie Archie	Moved here. Well, we had a doctor's office. Doctor's office down there on sixth street.	39:40
Paul Ortiz	Company doctor?	39:43
Johnnie Archie	Company doctor. You paid so much 75 cents a week or 50 cents a week, a dollar and quarter, something like that. A month. Doctor bill, you go there and get what medicine you need, doctor need on, wherever. We had a good doctor, we had a good doctor, had a boy got sick in school one day and they called the doctor. Doctor come and told him the best thing to get him to the doctor. Get him to the hospital. He had the acute appendix and got him to the doctor. Doctor take him in the room, had to cut him open, things bust in his hands. Yeah, you had a good doctor, Dr. Roundtree. He one of the best. Yeah, Dr. Roundtree was a good doctor.	39:43
Paul Ortiz	He was a White doctor?	40:36
Johnnie Archie	Yeah, he was. A White doctor. But what he told you, you could put your bottom dollar on it. Yeah.	40:37
Paul Ortiz	And then you retired in 1973.	40:52
Johnnie Archie	Right. January 31st, 1973.	40:54
Paul Ortiz	How many more years did Republic Steel continue operating?	41:00
Johnnie Archie	After I retired?	41:04
Paul Ortiz	Yeah.	41:07
Johnnie Archie	Oh '82 or '85. '82 or '85. I don't remember. Some reason the years, they cut out to furnaces shut down, the pig machine shut down. Cinder plants shut down. Then they eventually tore the furnaces down. But the byproduct, the coke mill, they still operated until what is '82 or '85? Really? '85? '82 or '85 right here.	41:09
Johnnie Archie	If I can find out just a minute if my son-in-law at the house. Exactly. What day did he come off on? What day did they come on?	41:53
Johnnie Archie	Hey, how you doing? Henry there? Let me speak with him. Just a minute. Hey, I want to speak with Henry. Yeah. What year did you all come off? Was it the plant—Did coke shut down? '82? We getting up some documents here. I thought it was '82. Okay. Okay. '82. What month was it? You know? You know what month? July the 17th. You did? Well they shut down then? Did they shut down then? Had them pushed the last of July the what? July the 17th. In '80. In '82. Pushed the last of them July the 15th of '82. Okay, thank you. You work two days on cleanup. Okay. July 17th, '82. Okay, thank you. All right. They shut down July the 17th in '82. That was my son-in-law. He worked there. He come up, I got him a job there and he was living in, he lived down in Thomason. He went to work there in '55.	42:06
Johnnie Archie	I got him a job. He had a big family. Had—What he had? Nine boys I believe. For fact he had nine boys and two girls—Or 10 boys, two girls. He had two, three or four children. Three children born. They got here. That's right. In '55. I got him a job here in '55. And that was him. I told him, yes. July 17 and '82 when the plant—coke pushed out. But the furnishing thing had been shut down way before then. They had them tore him down. Yeah.	44:19
Paul Ortiz	Mr. Archie, I have some, this information will go with the tape that we've made and this is just basic family kind of information in this first sheet back on.	45:04

Item Info

Title:

Johnnie Archie interview recording, 1994 June 17

Date:

June 17, 1994

Creator:

Archie, Johnnie W.

Contributor:

Ortiz, Paul

Description:

Name: Johnnie W. Archie; Date of birth: 1909-11-10; Place of birth: Lamison, AL; Occupation(s): construction; manufacturer; agriculture; Residence: Birmingham, AL
Informant ID: 735; Interviewed by: Paul Ortiz. Some of the images in the historical group were taken during the interview session and date from 1994.

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English

Digital Collection:

Behind the Veil

Source Collection:

Behind the Veil: Documenting African American Life in the Jim Crow South interviews, photographs, and project records, circa 1864-2011, bulk 1990-2004

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Provenance:

The David M. Rubenstein Rare Book and Manuscript Library acquired the Records of the Behind the Veil Oral History Project from the Duke University Center for Documentary Studies in 1997, 1998, 2000, and 2002.

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CC BY-NC 4.0

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Copyright for content created by the Behind the Veil project is held by Duke University and made available to the public using a Creative Commons Attribution / Non-commercial (CC-BY-NC) license.

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Interview number: 151
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9d9dfd25-1c2d-4c2e-9c13-b113c6495db4

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Johnnie Archie interview recording, 1994 June 17

Transcript

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1. Johnnie Archie administrative file, 1994

2. Johnnie Archie slides: J. W. Archie's family reunion, 1980s

3. Johnnie Archie slides: J. W. Archie's parents, 1920s

John Hope Franklin Research Center

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Johnnie Archie interview recording, 1994 June 17

Transcript

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