Ike Wheeler interview recording, 1994 June 22

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Stacey Scales	And where you from?	0:00
Ike Wheeler	Ike Wheeler.	0:00
Stacey Scales	Ike Wheeler.	0:01
Ike Wheeler	Uh-huh.	0:01
Stacey Scales	And were you born here, in this area?	0:06
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	0:56
Stacey Scales	You were born here?	0:56
Ike Wheeler	No, in Montgomery.	0:57
Stacey Scales	Oh, Montgomery?	0:57
Ike Wheeler	Uh-huh. Six miles below Montgomery, on the Mobile Highway.	0:58
Stacey Scales	Oh, yeah?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm.	1:24
Tywanna Whorley	When were you born?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	Ma'am?	1:24
Stacey Scales	When were you born?	1:24
Tywanna Whorley	When were you born?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	First of March.	1:24
Tywanna Whorley	March?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	Uh-huh. I'm 72 now.	1:24
Tywanna Whorley	72?	1:24
Stacey Scales	Oh, okay. Yeah.	1:24
Tywanna Whorley	Do you remember your grandparents?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	1:24
Tywanna Whorley	Do you remember your grandparents?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	Do I remember my grandparents?	1:24
Tywanna Whorley	Yes. Do you remember them?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	No.	1:24
Tywanna Whorley	No?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	Didn't know them.	1:24
Stacey Scales	How about your parents?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	Well, I knew my daddy but I didn't know my mother. I never knew my mother. She died when I was kid. Dead.	1:24
Stacey Scales	Yeah?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm.	1:24
Stacey Scales	Did they tell you stories?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	1:24
Stacey Scales	Did they tell you many stories about how things were during that time?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	No. No.	1:24
Stacey Scales	No?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	Uh-uh.	1:24
Tywanna Whorley	What do you remember about your father?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	1:24
Stacey Scales	Your dad.	1:24
Ike Wheeler	Who?	1:24
Stacey Scales	Do you remember about your father?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	Do I remember him?	1:24
Stacey Scales	Yes. What do you remember about him?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	Yeah, I know about him. Yeah, he was with me.	1:24
Stacey Scales	What did he do?	1:24
Ike Wheeler	Huh? He was working on a farm. Six miles below Montgomery, on a farm. That's when we moved here, years ago. But he was working for the Southern Railroad when he died.	1:24
Stacey Scales	Oh, yeah?	1:30
Ike Wheeler	Yeah, he had been working over there about five—I guess five or six years or more.	1:32
Stacey Scales	Okay.	1:38
Ike Wheeler	On the railroad over there.	1:38
Tywanna Whorley	What was his name?	1:43
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	1:44
Tywanna Whorley	What was his name?	1:44
Ike Wheeler	Wheeler, Ike Wheeler.	1:44
Tywanna Whorley	So you're named after him?	1:44
Ike Wheeler	I'm named after him. My name is Ike.	1:46
Tywanna Whorley	So you're Ike Junior?	1:47
Ike Wheeler	Yes, I am.	1:47
Tywanna Whorley	Do you have any sisters and brothers?	1:47
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	1:47
Tywanna Whorley	Do you have any sisters and brothers?	1:47
Ike Wheeler	Any brothers?	1:47
Tywanna Whorley	Uh-huh.	1:47
Ike Wheeler	I had one brother, but I didn't know him. See, I never knew my mother. My stepmother raised me.	1:48
Tywanna Whorley	What was her name?	1:48
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	1:48
Tywanna Whorley	What was her name?	1:48
Stacey Scales	Her name?	1:48
Ike Wheeler	Lisa.	1:48
Stacey Scales	Okay.	1:48
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm. That was in Montgomery. I moved here years ago.	1:48
Stacey Scales	What brought you to this area?	2:19
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	2:20
Stacey Scales	What brought you here? What made you come here?	2:21
Ike Wheeler	I got tired of working on a farm for nothing.	2:25
Stacey Scales	Oh, yeah?	2:32
Ike Wheeler	So I left and come here. My sister was already here. She was staying over there at section soil. I come here and got a job out there on the railroad.	2:34
Stacey Scales	Oh, yeah?	2:35
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm. Wasn't but two of us, just me and her.	2:35
Tywanna Whorley	What was her name?	2:35
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	2:36
Tywanna Whorley	What was her name?	2:44
Ike Wheeler	Mary Lou Lionel. Mary Lou Lionel. She went under a horrible name, Mary Lou Lionel.	2:44
Tywanna Whorley	Where did you stay once you came here?	2:49
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	2:49
Stacey Scales	Where did you live here? Where did you live when you came to Birmingham?	2:49
Ike Wheeler	Was I living here?	2:49
Stacey Scales	Where did you live?	2:49
Ike Wheeler	I left Montgomery. You said where did I live at?	2:49
Stacey Scales	Yes, sir.	2:49
Ike Wheeler	Over there on Southern. Southern Railroad, they had section houses.	3:14
Stacey Scales	Oh, yeah?	3:14
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. I had stayed in these section house, then I got a job over her and then I moved out and moved over here.	3:17
Stacey Scales	Okay. Did you ever have time to have—	3:21
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	3:21
Stacey Scales	—Was there ever times where people treated you bad? The White folks.	3:22
Ike Wheeler	No. Everybody was nice to me.	3:27
Stacey Scales	Yeah?	3:27
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm. They were mighty nice to me. See, you didn't ask me for this but I'm going to tell you. You start it right with White folks, it end right.	3:27
Stacey Scales	Hm.	3:38
Ike Wheeler	Don't never go in there sneaking and grinning up in his face, just tell him what you need and go head on.	3:43
Stacey Scales	It was times you had to do that?	3:47
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	3:49
Stacey Scales	Was it times that you had to do that?	3:49
Ike Wheeler	No, I stayed the way I started in with them.	3:51
Stacey Scales	Oh, okay.	3:53
Ike Wheeler	That's what I say, folks say to me, "Well, Whites don't play." I say, "No, I don't play. I'm a man. I played when I was a child." If you start right on anything, you end right. That's [indistinct 00:04:17]. See, that stuff foul. So treat him right, he going to treat you right. But see, I don't want to take you on the course of me wanting to say this, they'll try you. Take that little bit, they'll put a little bit more on you. So start right and it'll end right.	3:57
Ike Wheeler	All of them, they hated to see me retire from there. [indistinct 00:04:35] now. Anything that they would—You would have to let them know that you coming to help them. What you want, something to sit on?	4:23
Stacey Scales	Yes, sir.	4:42
Ike Wheeler	I don't know what you going to sit—A chair or what. I don't know. Pull that rocker out here.	4:42
Tywanna Whorley	How much did you earn when you worked for the railroad?	5:02
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	5:02
Tywanna Whorley	How much did you earn when you worked for the railroad?	5:02
Ike Wheeler	It wasn't too much. That was way back in the day. We went into work—It's been so long, I forgot it. What they say? Once a man, twice a child. You forget. But you may think it's wrong. I put anything down, I forget where I put it. I can't find it. That boy there help me find it. I can't help it. So they just—He was born right here. That's my grand boy. Was raised right here. Mm-hmm. I got three or four children. Raised all of them right here.	5:09
Stacey Scales	Did you get married when you came here?	5:34
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	5:42
Stacey Scales	You got married when you came here?	5:43
Ike Wheeler	No, I married in Montgomery.	5:44
Stacey Scales	Okay. When was that? Do you remember?	5:52
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	5:52
Stacey Scales	Do you remember when you got—	5:52
Ike Wheeler	No.	5:52
Stacey Scales	—How old you were?	5:52
Ike Wheeler	I was about 18 or 19 years old.	5:52
Stacey Scales	Oh, yeah?	5:52
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm. Yeah. That's been a long time.	5:52
Stacey Scales	You still remember it?	5:52
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. My wife just died here, maybe about two weeks ago.	6:01
Stacey Scales	Oh, yeah?	6:02
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm. She was here. Me and her didn't never separate, until what—when what was, we still [indistinct 00:06:10]. You'll never know when—Me and her would go back home in the morning and would start to fuss.	6:06
Stacey Scales	Right.	6:15
Ike Wheeler	She didn't never leave me.	6:16
Stacey Scales	What was her name?	6:17
Ike Wheeler	Cassie Mae Wheeler.	6:18
Stacey Scales	Cassie.	6:19
Ike Wheeler	Cassie Mae.	6:19
Stacey Scales	What did she do?	6:22
Ike Wheeler	Nothing.	6:22
Stacey Scales	A housewife?	6:22
Ike Wheeler	That's right.	6:22
Stacey Scales	Okay.	6:22
Ike Wheeler	That's right. I was a great hustler.	6:22
Stacey Scales	You were a what?	6:22
Ike Wheeler	I said, "I was a great hustler."	6:22
Stacey Scales	Oh, yeah?	6:22
Ike Wheeler	Yes, sir.	6:25
Stacey Scales	What type of things did you do for entertainment?	6:41
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	6:43
Stacey Scales	What type of things did you do for fun? Did you get out?	6:44
Ike Wheeler	For what?	6:49
Stacey Scales	Would you get out?	6:50
Ike Wheeler	What would I do?	6:50
Stacey Scales	Yes.	6:50
Ike Wheeler	I used to drink. Get out and ball with the balls, like that.	6:52
Stacey Scales	Do you remember any of the places you used to go?	6:57
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	6:58
Stacey Scales	Do you remember any of the places that you—	6:58
Ike Wheeler	No. I know them, but I don't remember them all like that.	6:58
Tywanna Whorley	Did you hang around 4th Avenue?	6:58
Stacey Scales	How about 4th Avenue?	6:58
Ike Wheeler	No, I never hung around up there. Fourth Avenue used to be a bad place up there. I never did hang on 4th Avenue.	7:14
Stacey Scales	Oh, yeah?	7:16
Ike Wheeler	They used to go to the show up there on 4th Avenue.	7:16
Stacey Scales	Where?	7:16
Ike Wheeler	Picture shows on 4th Avenue. That's where the pictures were.	7:16
Stacey Scales	Why do you call it a bad place?	7:25
Ike Wheeler	It was. You know how people used to—You don't know, but you heard about it. Yes, sir. I never did hang out up there. I wasn't hanging—I wasn't going to bet nobody, but I wasn't hanging and hanging out different places. I never did go over there.	7:36
Stacey Scales	How long did you work for the railroad?	7:50
Ike Wheeler	About three or four years, I guess, before I came over here.	8:02
Stacey Scales	How long did you work over here?	8:02
Ike Wheeler	I worked over here, I guess about nine years.	8:02
Tywanna Whorley	Was it more money?	8:03
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	8:03
Tywanna Whorley	Was it more money working over there?	8:10
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. Uh-huh. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. [indistinct 00:08:18].	8:11
Stacey Scales	When you moved into your house, were you renting it or did you own it?	8:18
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	8:20
Stacey Scales	Did you own your house?	8:21
Ike Wheeler	This house?	8:23
Stacey Scales	The house that you moved into when you came to Birmingham.	8:24
Ike Wheeler	No. I worked for the railroad then. The railroad got section houses.	8:31
Stacey Scales	Right.	8:32
Ike Wheeler	No. When I moved out of that section house, I moved over here, in here.	8:35
Stacey Scales	You brought it?	8:37
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	8:37
Stacey Scales	You moved over here to rent or did you buy?	8:37
Ike Wheeler	When I first came here, this was a company house.	8:42
Stacey Scales	Oh, yeah?	8:44
Ike Wheeler	That's right. It didn't have but two rooms. They cut your rent. When the company was going out, they sold the house, so I bought this one and added to it. It's just like that over yonder. They say it's just like all the rest of them were. See that across the street where somebody started to fix a porch?	8:48
Stacey Scales	Yes.	9:14
Ike Wheeler	It ain't but two rooms.	9:14
Stacey Scales	Oh, okay. Two rooms?	9:14
Ike Wheeler	That's what all these houses were, from here clean on down. It's just but two rooms, just like yonder.	9:14
Stacey Scales	This area was all Black folk?	9:19
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. Mm-hmm. White folks were back up yonder. You crossed the railroad and keep straight on up in equal.	9:22
Stacey Scales	Oh, yeah?	9:24
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm.	9:29
Tywanna Whorley	What was the two rooms? You said it was a two room house and that—Was it a bedroom and the—	9:29
Ike Wheeler	Ma'am?	9:29
Tywanna Whorley	—The two rooms—	9:29
Stacey Scales	Bedroom—What were the rooms?	9:30
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	9:30
Stacey Scales	Was it a—the front room and a back room?	9:40
Ike Wheeler	What, over here?	9:41
Stacey Scales	Yes.	9:41
Ike Wheeler	It wasn't but two rooms, bedroom and a kitchen.	9:46
Stacey Scales	Okay.	9:48
Ike Wheeler	That's all.	9:48
Stacey Scales	How many people stayed in—	9:51
Ike Wheeler	Nobody but me and my wife back in those days.	9:51
Stacey Scales	Okay.	9:51
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm.	9:51
Tywanna Whorley	Do you remember how much you paid for it?	9:51
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	9:51
Stacey Scales	How much was it? The house. You said it was a company house.	9:51
Ike Wheeler	75 cents for lights and 75 cents for water. But these company houses—	10:05
Stacey Scales	Right.	10:07
Ike Wheeler	—So you were working—I was working for the company. The company went down and sold the house, that's the reason I—I added all this to this house.	10:07
Stacey Scales	Did you do it by yourself?	10:18
Ike Wheeler	No. I didn't do it, I had it done. No, I didn't want to do it myself.	10:19
Stacey Scales	Did you go to school—	10:25
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	10:25
Stacey Scales	Coming up?	10:25
Ike Wheeler	No. I was raised without parents, so I didn't go.	10:30
Stacey Scales	Okay.	10:31
Ike Wheeler	No. And when I did get big enough to work—I had gotten big enough, I had to go to work. And it wasn't but two, me and my sister. We come up on the rough side of the mountain, so she—She been saved. She saved, I guess about, seven, eight years now. She still belong to Southern.	10:32
Stacey Scales	Yeah?	10:46
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm.	10:46
Tywanna Whorley	[indistinct 00:10:48]?	10:46
Stacey Scales	What do you mean by the rough side of the mountain? You come up on—	10:46
Ike Wheeler	That's just, don't be so [indistinct 00:10:48] like it's supposed to be. That's it.	10:46
Stacey Scales	Yes.	10:46
Ike Wheeler	Ain't you heard that song, says the children sees a hard time when the mother is dead? You ain't never heard that?	10:46
Stacey Scales	No.	10:46
Ike Wheeler	You heard it.	10:46
Tywanna Whorley	[indistinct 00:10:48].	10:46
Ike Wheeler	Well that's a song they used to sing.	10:46
Stacey Scales	Okay.	10:48
Ike Wheeler	It's true.	11:24
Stacey Scales	Right.	11:45
Ike Wheeler	Me and my sister partly raised ourself. Yeah. And the good Lord took care of us. I never even knew my mother.	11:45
Stacey Scales	No?	11:45
Ike Wheeler	Uh-uh. I wasn't big enough to know her.	11:45
Tywanna Whorley	What did your family do for—I guess, together.	11:50
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	11:50
Tywanna Whorley	When you first had a family, what did you guys do, I guess as a family, together? To maybe—the kids—I guess in terms of a family outing.	11:50
Ike Wheeler	When I got the family?	11:50
Stacey Scales	Your family. When did your family get together?	11:59
Ike Wheeler	You said did they get together?	11:59
Stacey Scales	Yeah. How was the get togethers when—	12:03
Ike Wheeler	I stayed with my daddy. I told you, I didn't never know my mother.	12:07
Stacey Scales	Right.	12:22
Ike Wheeler	Well, I married a little early and got me a house. I had one children in the bed and [indistinct 00:12:27].	12:22
Stacey Scales	Okay.	12:22
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. A heap of people [indistinct 00:12:33] see but they don't know him.	12:32
Stacey Scales	Right.	12:34
Ike Wheeler	That's right. Yeah.	12:34
Tywanna Whorley	Did you ever hear of any incidents, like happen to your friends, where people were—	12:39
Ike Wheeler	Ma'am?	12:42
Tywanna Whorley	Did anybody ever talk to you about—Or did you hear about incidents where people got into scuffles or fights with White people? Did you ever hear about anything like that?	12:45
Ike Wheeler	White people?	12:59
Tywanna Whorley	Uh-huh.	13:00
Ike Wheeler	No.	13:00
Tywanna Whorley	No?	13:00
Ike Wheeler	There never was any White people. Nobody but the man that [indistinct 00:13:01]—Because I saw him on a plantation. He came down there and we worked for him.	13:04
Tywanna Whorley	Uh-huh.	13:05
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm.	13:05
Tywanna Whorley	Okay. What about—	13:05
Ike Wheeler	And you know what I was working for back in the days?	13:05
Tywanna Whorley	How much?	13:05
Ike Wheeler	50 cents.	13:05
Tywanna Whorley	50 cents?	13:05
Ike Wheeler	That's the truth. That's what I started out with, 50 cents.	13:05
Tywanna Whorley	Did it ever go up?	13:05
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. It got to a dollar, that's as high as it got.	13:05
Tywanna Whorley	To a dollar?	13:05
Stacey Scales	How did that make you feel?	13:05
Ike Wheeler	Eight hours. Not eight hours, from sun to sun. That's when you know—It wasn't any eight hours then. Yes, sir.	13:28
Stacey Scales	Did you ever get mad?	13:32
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	13:32
Stacey Scales	Did you ever get mad over that?	13:38
Ike Wheeler	No. It wasn't any need in getting mad, because I couldn't do anything about it. Yeah, I couldn't do it. Then people raised the biggest stuff to eat. They had chickens and hogs, turkeys, all stuff like that. They raised that. And corn. They carried corn to the mill and grinds. You don't know anything about that. Hm?	13:40
Stacey Scales	No, sir.	13:49
Ike Wheeler	And have them old 50 pound cans of lard, sitting in the smokehouse, waiting on you to kill the hogs. I done that right here.	14:06
Stacey Scales	How did you kill the hogs?	14:08
Ike Wheeler	Go out there and knock him in the head and cut his toes, and hang him up.	14:16
Stacey Scales	Yeah?	14:19
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. I had that little old house out there now, it ain't nothing. I had it full of meat and lard. Fifty pound cans of lard.	14:20
Stacey Scales	Do you still do that now?	14:29
Ike Wheeler	No. No, no. Uh-uh. It's been years since I did that. That's what we used to do.	14:34
Stacey Scales	Right.	14:34
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm.	14:34
Stacey Scales	So with the family, did you give meat away or would you keep it?	14:40
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	14:41
Stacey Scales	Did you give meat away or would you keep the meat?	14:43
Ike Wheeler	No, that was for me to live on. That's what I'm saying.	14:45
Stacey Scales	For family.	14:45
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. That's for us to live off of.	14:45
Tywanna Whorley	Did you raise [indistinct 00:14:52]—	14:45
Ike Wheeler	Wasn't only me, everybody was doing that. That's the reason—For us Black folks, that's the way we came up. On the rough side of the mountain. Ma'am?	14:55
Tywanna Whorley	Did you raise a garden?	14:58
Ike Wheeler	Garden?	14:58
Tywanna Whorley	Mm-hmm.	14:58
Ike Wheeler	I sure did. Had a garden right over there before that house—where that house at. It wasn't any house there then. They had one there, but they tore it down. Yeah, I had a garden.	15:06
Tywanna Whorley	What did you raise in the garden?	15:14
Ike Wheeler	Greens and sweet potatoes, [indistinct 00:15:19] on the North side out there. Okra, all stuff like that. And had hogs too.	15:15
Tywanna Whorley	How much was a hog back then?	15:21
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	15:21
Tywanna Whorley	Do you remember how much you paid for a hog back then?	15:21
Ike Wheeler	No. It wasn't much. You know things were cheap, it wasn't much. Hogs [indistinct 00:15:35]—Across the railroad, where those hogs were at over there, that was—Everybody had hogs over there. That's true.	15:35
Tywanna Whorley	How did people know which hog was theirs?	15:47
Ike Wheeler	You had your pen and I had my pen. You laugh, but that's true. People raised the biggest what they had. In that yard out there, you know I get two or three dozen eggs a day if I'm out there? My chickens.	15:49
Stacey Scales	Yeah?	16:03
Ike Wheeler	You didn't have nothing to buy but some flour, and a sack of meal. You had your meat and lard out there, and your yard full of chickens. That's the truth. With my right hand to God, this yard used to be full of chickens. You see, you could go and buy them biddies. But you go up and down and you buy those biddies and raise them. That's how you get started with your chickens. Smokehouse full of meat, sausage, ham and everything.	16:05
Tywanna Whorley	Did you build the smokehouse?	16:31
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	16:31
Tywanna Whorley	Did you build the smokehouse?	16:40
Ike Wheeler	Yes, ma'am.	16:41
Stacey Scales	Was it a time when neighbors needed some food and you [indistinct 00:16:46]—	16:42
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	16:46
Stacey Scales	Was it times when neighbors may have needed some food or something?	16:47
Ike Wheeler	No. All of us was putting you on the same thing.	16:50
Stacey Scales	Oh, yeah.	16:53
Ike Wheeler	Uh-huh.	16:53
Stacey Scales	Okay.	16:53
Ike Wheeler	And see, I was working, making some money down there in the plant. And I retired off that plant.	16:53
Tywanna Whorley	When you had to go to town, had did you travel?	17:04
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	17:05
Tywanna Whorley	When you had to go to town to get something, how did you travel?	17:07
Ike Wheeler	The grocery?	17:09
Tywanna Whorley	Yeah, grocery.	17:09
Ike Wheeler	No. Store right across the road over yonder.	17:11
Tywanna Whorley	Walking distance?	17:11
Ike Wheeler	Grocery store. They were good people, buy your groceries and they'd bring it home in the truck for you. You didn't have to tote it.	17:11
Tywanna Whorley	Was it Black owned?	17:21
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	17:21
Tywanna Whorley	Was it Black owned?	17:23
Ike Wheeler	No, White people.	17:24
Tywanna Whorley	White people?	17:25
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm. Dagos, Italians.	17:25
Tywanna Whorley	Dagos?	17:25
Ike Wheeler	Uh-huh. (laughs)	17:25
Stacey Scales	Did they treat you all right in there?	17:25
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. They treat you better than the White folks will. Yeah. Of course he was White, but a different nation. I was over there one day in the store and for some reason, I said, "I can't eat that, Jimmy. That's too hard." And this teenager girl, she—Said, "Ike, what did you say?" I said, "I can't eat that." She said, "Don't ever let me hear you say that no more." She said, "You can eat anything anybody else it." That's what she told me, a White girl. "You can eat anything anybody else eat."	17:32
Ike Wheeler	Because that was her daddy store. She was at her store. But she was right.	17:46
Stacey Scales	How did that make you feel to hear that?	17:46
Ike Wheeler	That cut my feelings too.	17:46
Stacey Scales	Cut your what?	17:46
Ike Wheeler	Cut my feelings down, you know.	17:46
Stacey Scales	Right. Right.	17:46
Ike Wheeler	But she was right. I tell you what it was, it was dagos, Italians. You know how they are, they always—They ain't like these White folks. Dagos treat you heaps better than the White folks. Yes, sir. She the one told me I can eat anything anybody else eat. Those dagos, they were nice people, so—	17:46
Tywanna Whorley	Did you have a credit with them?	17:46
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	17:46
Tywanna Whorley	Did you have a credit with them?	17:46
Ike Wheeler	Credit with them?	17:46
Tywanna Whorley	Yes.	17:46
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yes. [indistinct 00:17:47] just as good, you can get on out and get anything you want.	17:46
Tywanna Whorley	Uh-huh.	17:47
Ike Wheeler	Sure could. He'd put it in the truck and bring it home. You didn't have to tote it. Deliver it for you.	17:47
Tywanna Whorley	So when did you pay on your credit?	17:47
Ike Wheeler	Yeah, I pay on it when I get the groceries.	17:47
Tywanna Whorley	Uh-huh.	17:47
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm. Back then, he credited you.	17:47
Tywanna Whorley	Did you ever pay it up?	17:47
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	17:47
Tywanna Whorley	Did you ever pay up your credit?	17:47
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. Yeah, I pay him every pay day.	17:47
Tywanna Whorley	Every pay day?	17:47
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. I give him pay from the [indistinct 00:19:12]. When it's pay day, I go down there and pay them.	17:47
Tywanna Whorley	When was pay day? Every week or every two weeks?	17:47
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	17:47
Tywanna Whorley	When was pay day?	17:47
Ike Wheeler	I think it was about twice a month, I think, or something like that.	17:47
Tywanna Whorley	So you got paid twice a month from the plant?	17:47
Ike Wheeler	Yeah, down here at the [indistinct 00:19:28].	17:47
Tywanna Whorley	Was that where you were making a dollar at?	17:47
Ike Wheeler	Uh-huh. Yeah, that's where I was at.	17:47
Tywanna Whorley	Were there any Black people working over there [indistinct 00:19:37]?	17:47
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	17:47
Tywanna Whorley	Were there any Blacks over there making more than a dollar?	17:47
Ike Wheeler	Making more?	17:47
Tywanna Whorley	Than a dollar [indistinct 00:19:42]—	17:47
Ike Wheeler	No, I—He had some of them had better jobs.	17:47
Tywanna Whorley	Uh-huh.	17:47
Ike Wheeler	Depends on the job, you know.	17:47
Tywanna Whorley	Uh-huh.	17:47
Ike Wheeler	He had some of them, some [indistinct 00:19:50] ones, things like that.	17:57
Tywanna Whorley	Uh-huh.	18:30
Ike Wheeler	Conductors, all like that.	18:30
Stacey Scales	Were there any Black folks—	18:30
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	18:30
Stacey Scales	—Who people thought were White?	18:30
Ike Wheeler	What you say?	18:30
Stacey Scales	Were there any Black folks around that people thought were White?	19:59
Ike Wheeler	Down there in the plant?	20:26
Stacey Scales	Yeah.	20:26
Ike Wheeler	Yeah, goodness. Yeah.	20:26
Stacey Scales	Could you talk about that?	20:26
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	20:26
Stacey Scales	Could you tell us about that?	20:26
Ike Wheeler	You say talk about it?	20:26
Stacey Scales	Yes, sir.	20:26
Ike Wheeler	Yeah, you talk, those White folks treat you just like you're better than your own folks.	20:26
Stacey Scales	Right.	20:26
Ike Wheeler	Sure would. Yes, sir. I remember, I worked down there for years. Treat you better than your own [indistinct 00:20:30] people. Anything I wanted down there, they'd get it. "Say, Ike? Do you need so and so?" "Yes, sir." [indistinct 00:20:39], go back over there and get it.	20:47
Ike Wheeler	One of them, I had to get him told. Hollering and cussing at me, Lord have mercy. Shoot me down. He said, "I ain't going to cuss you no more." I said, "I know you ain't, because you cuss me again, this place won't hold me and you." I said, "You got anything to do, tell me, don't you holler at me, man." He said, "Whites don't play", so I said, "No, I played when I was a child. I'm a man, I don't play." [indistinct 00:21:18].	20:47
Ike Wheeler	I ain't going to change your subject, but you put a little bit on and you take that and put a little bit more on it. [indistinct 00:21:27], right there. I told him, "Ain't but two things don't you never do." I said, "Don't you holler at me and don't you cuss me, because me and you both will get hung up in that gate, getting out of here." He didn't bother me either. The superintendent even told me. He said, "Wheeler?" I told him, "Yes, sir." "I thought you were fixing to retire, boy." I told him, "Yes, I sure am." He said, "Well if you need us, let us know." That was nice. I appreciate it. That was the head man down there. [indistinct 00:22:06].	21:20
Tywanna Whorley	Were there people who were afraid that—I mean the time—	22:05
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	22:05
Tywanna Whorley	The stand that you took, did a lot of other Blacks take that stand, or did they just—	22:05
Ike Wheeler	Did a lot of Black folks?	22:08
Tywanna Whorley	Yes.	22:08
Stacey Scales	Did they do the same thing you did?	22:10
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	22:13
Stacey Scales	Did they do the same thing you did? [indistinct 00:22:21]—	22:13
Ike Wheeler	About talking to White folks?	22:20
Stacey Scales	Yes.	22:20
Ike Wheeler	I don't know. See, I was on a different job. They did on my job. You see, it don't be a lot of them old crackers treat you nice. You know how some crackers are.	22:20
Stacey Scales	Right.	22:32
Ike Wheeler	You stomp his toe, they ain't going to get a little further to you. You just keep—He getting close to you. Wonder when you do that stomping right then. I told him, "Two things don't you ever do." I said, "Don't you holler at me and don't you cuss me, because I'm not going to cuss you. Don't you holler at me, man." "I ain't going to holler at you no more." I said, "I know you ain't. You got anything to tell me, come tell me." You start right, you'll end right. That's the same way with your own folks. You start with your own folks right, you end right. You put this little bit on you, you take this, you put a little bit more on you. [indistinct 00:23:09]. So I got along fine with them.	22:32
Ike Wheeler	And don't play. [indistinct 00:23:19] playing. Played when you was a child. That's right. Treat them right and they will treat you right.	23:14
Tywanna Whorley	How was it living in this community?	23:25
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	23:25
Tywanna Whorley	How was it living in this community?	23:25
Ike Wheeler	How many?	23:25
Tywanna Whorley	No.	23:25
Stacey Scales	How was life, living over here [indistinct 00:23:37]—	23:35
Ike Wheeler	It was nice. This a nice community in here. They kept it clean. Understand, all this was company. From here, way on back where y'all come in at—Now that wasn't a road, the road was right over here. That was a highway, but see how they put sand and needles out there? They changed that. That's an old road out there. Mm-hmm, that's an old road out there. Yeah, it was nice. Old crackers see that you do right, he'll do right. [indistinct 00:24:54]. See, he'll wear you. He put this little bit on you, [indistinct 00:24:54]. Yes, sir. So that's the only two things don't you ever do, don't you holler at me and don't you cuss me. Because I might gone cuss you. "I ain't going to cuss you, Wheeler." I said, "I know you ain't."	23:37
Stacey Scales	Were they afraid of you?	24:54
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	24:54
Stacey Scales	Were they afraid of you? Were they scared of you?	24:54
Ike Wheeler	No. It's just the way you start with them. [indistinct 00:24:57] I just said it, [indistinct 00:24:57] where they recognize [indistinct 00:24:57]. Hm? You got any children?	24:56
Stacey Scales	No, sir.	24:56
Ike Wheeler	Well you know that. You recognized your daddy, didn't you?	24:57
Stacey Scales	Yes.	24:59
Ike Wheeler	All right, then. That's good enough. You start right, you'll end right. [indistinct 00:25:05]. I talk so much, you can't say anything, can you? But that's the truth, baby. I wouldn't tell no lie. That's the God's honest truth.	24:59
Tywanna Whorley	When you traveled to town, how did you go to town?	25:19
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	25:19
Stacey Scales	How did you get to town when you went to town?	25:19
Ike Wheeler	Streetcars. Yeah, there was a streetcar and there was a bus, run right there. Streetcar used to run right along there. See those trees there? [indistinct 00:25:31] on this side of the car line. Doesn't look like any car line is in there. When they cut the cars out, the bus run. The bus run out there now, on the other side of the road there, the bus run. And it's [indistinct 00:25:42] cars. Then the grocery store was right across the railroad there, two of them. Mm-hmm.	25:25
Stacey Scales	Did they make you ride in a different section?	25:52
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	26:02
Stacey Scales	Where did you sit on the—	26:02
Ike Wheeler	Any place. You know how they used to do you. You heard about it. Back in those days, your seats were back. [indistinct 00:26:07] in the front, and it's Black in the back. That's right.	26:06
Stacey Scales	What did you think about that?	26:06
Ike Wheeler	It wasn't nothing I could do about that, just go on to the back and sit down. See one, somebody can't [indistinct 00:26:18] something like that. [indistinct 00:26:21], that's something I ain't got to deal with. Yes, sir. So I've been doing pretty good since I been sick. The wife been gone. [indistinct 00:26:38] come in and see about me. It's been really nice here.	26:13
Stacey Scales	Did you ever have any hard times, where there wasn't anything to eat?	26:38
Ike Wheeler	No. No.	26:38
Stacey Scales	No? Never?	26:38
Ike Wheeler	Never did. I was raised on a farm. We raised our food. We didn't have to buy anything but some flour, sugar, like that. [indistinct 00:26:42]. Raised plenty chickens and hogs, milked cows, all that. I raised all that.	26:38
Tywanna Whorley	[indistinct 00:26:42]?	26:38
Stacey Scales	What did you spend your money on?	26:38
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	26:38
Stacey Scales	The money that you made—	26:38
Ike Wheeler	You didn't make that much, just to buy you some clothes and stuff. You didn't make that much.	26:38
Stacey Scales	Yes.	26:38
Ike Wheeler	You know how [indistinct 00:26:42] working for 50 cents a day? That's true. It ain't no lie.	26:42
Stacey Scales	I don't know how that was.	27:52
Ike Wheeler	If you didn't raise your stuff, you [indistinct 00:27:53] to buy nothing. [indistinct 00:27:53] was tight. Hoover put the panties on the United States. [indistinct 00:27:53] talking about Hoover, they—That's who did it. Yes, sir. See, I was living six miles below Montgomery, in the country. I sure was.	27:53
Stacey Scales	Where did you buy your clothes, sir?	27:58
Ike Wheeler	Montgomery town, in the town.	28:01
Stacey Scales	Do you remember Hoover?	28:11
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	28:11
Stacey Scales	Do you remember Hoover?	28:13
Ike Wheeler	Yeah, you know I remember. Yeah, I remember him. Yes.	28:14
Stacey Scales	Could you tell us about him?	28:14
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	28:14
Stacey Scales	Could you tell us about him?	28:20
Ike Wheeler	[indistinct 00:28:24] starvation here, that's what he did. [indistinct 00:28:29] boys got killed, [indistinct 00:28:30] way back in those days.	28:24
Stacey Scales	Mm-hmm.	28:56
Ike Wheeler	No, you didn't hear about it. You heard about it, ain't you?	29:01
Tywanna Whorley	[indistinct 00:29:02]?	29:01
Ike Wheeler	That was Hoover days then.	29:01
Tywanna Whorley	Uh-huh.	29:01
Ike Wheeler	That was Hoover days. You—	29:01
Stacey Scales	Do you remember when that happened?	29:01
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	29:01
Stacey Scales	Do you remember that?	29:01
Ike Wheeler	Yes. I'm telling you now. Do you know who put you to eating good and [indistinct 00:29:02]? Huh? President Roosevelt, he got in there. He put you to living good. He told them, "Go and get all that meat and stuff, and stuff you got packed [indistinct 00:29:10], and get it out of there." Sure did. President Roosevelt, [indistinct 00:29:21], and just kept it going up. It was hell. Shit. Sure was. If folks hadn't have raised something, I don't know what they would have done. Don't know what they'd do, but you raised hogs and chickens, and things like that. [indistinct 00:29:55]. You ain't never seen a [indistinct 00:29:55] patch, did you?	29:01
Stacey Scales	Yes.	29:55
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. [indistinct 00:29:55]—	29:55
Stacey Scales	What did you do when the cold came?	29:55
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	29:56
Stacey Scales	What did you do when it got cold?	29:57
Ike Wheeler	[indistinct 00:29:59]	29:58
Stacey Scales	Yeah.	29:59
Ike Wheeler	Just put them in a bank, baby. You ain't never seen a potato bank?	30:02
Stacey Scales	No, sir.	30:06
Ike Wheeler	You will let them potatoes get some vines, [indistinct 00:30:14], and you'll go out there and plow those potatoes up. And pick them up all up and put that—Just like your leg, that's a stick.	30:09
Stacey Scales	Mm-hmm.	30:22
Ike Wheeler	And put that stick down and put some hay around it, and stack those potatoes up beside that stick, and that bank, that's a potato bank. And take some cornstalks and go all the way around it, that's to keep the potatoes from falling in. And cover over it with dirt and put some on the top of it. When you got ready to go there and make a whole, you go right in there and get your potatoes up.	30:23
Stacey Scales	All right.	30:35
Ike Wheeler	That's the way you did. People back then, they were raised with that. They said they were raised, that's all.	30:35
Stacey Scales	Did you vote?	30:35
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	30:35
Stacey Scales	Did you vote back—Vote.	30:35
Ike Wheeler	Did I vote?	30:35
Stacey Scales	Yes, sir.	30:35
Ike Wheeler	Yeah, I voted. Mm-hmm. Yeah, I voted out there at the church. They came out there and I voted out there.	30:35
Stacey Scales	What's the name of the church?	30:35
Ike Wheeler	Mount Hill Baptist Church.	30:35
Stacey Scales	Mount Hill Baptist?	30:35
Ike Wheeler	Yeah, I belong out there.	30:35
Stacey Scales	Okay.	30:36
Ike Wheeler	I'm [indistinct 00:31:06] out there, but I don't be out there now much. I get there every now and then. I helped build that church out there.	31:05
Tywanna Whorley	You did? You built it? You helped build it?	31:15
Ike Wheeler	Yeah, I helped build it. [indistinct 00:31:24]	31:15
Stacey Scales	When was that?	31:15
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	31:15
Stacey Scales	How old were you when—	31:15
Ike Wheeler	I don't know, it's been a long time.	31:15
Stacey Scales	Do you remember how old you were?	31:15
Ike Wheeler	I don't know. Huh?	31:15
Stacey Scales	How old were you when [indistinct 00:31:34]—	31:15
Ike Wheeler	I don't know, it's been so long, I forgot. My numbers aren't good now. It's been quite a while.	31:37
Tywanna Whorley	Were you working at the plant?	31:39
Ike Wheeler	Yeah, I was still working down there. Mm-hmm.	31:40
Tywanna Whorley	When you built that?	31:40
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm.	31:40
Tywanna Whorley	Okay.	31:40
Ike Wheeler	Yeah.	31:40
Tywanna Whorley	Did you vote for Hoover?	31:50
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	31:50
Tywanna Whorley	Did you vote for Hoover?	31:50
Ike Wheeler	Do I know some coal workers?	31:50
Stacey Scales	Did you vote for Hoover?	31:50
Ike Wheeler	No.	31:51
Stacey Scales	No?	31:51
Ike Wheeler	No. Uh-uh.	31:54
Stacey Scales	You voted for Roosevelt?	31:58
Ike Wheeler	Yeah.	31:58
Tywanna Whorley	[indistinct 00:32:04]	31:58
Stacey Scales	During the times when Hoover was in the office, how did your family survive? How did they get along?	32:07
Ike Wheeler	We were raised plenty on what we had, just raised it. Chickens and hogs. It was like I told you a while ago, you didn't have nothing to buy. If I want, just go buy a pack of flour. That's all you had to buy. And some sugar and coffee, like that. But meat and lard, you had that. Yes, sir.	32:15
Tywanna Whorley	Do you remember the [indistinct 00:32:40] Boys?	32:30
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	32:30
Tywanna Whorley	Do you remember the Scottsboro Boys?	32:45
Ike Wheeler	Scottsboro Boys?	32:45
Tywanna Whorley	Uh-huh.	32:45
Ike Wheeler	Yeah, I remember that, when they started that mess. Yeah. Mm-hmm. I remember it.	32:46
Tywanna Whorley	What do you remember about it?	32:49
Ike Wheeler	Montgomery.	32:49
Tywanna Whorley	Mm-hmm.	32:49
Ike Wheeler	Six miles below Montgomery, that happened.	32:54
Stacey Scales	Could you tell us about it?	32:54
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	32:54
Stacey Scales	Could you tell us about it?	32:54
Ike Wheeler	I just heard it, I didn't know how it was. I just heard about it, how that happened, like that.	32:54
Stacey Scales	How did you hear about it?	32:54
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	32:54
Stacey Scales	How did you get your news?	33:06
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	33:14
Stacey Scales	How did you get your news?	33:18
Ike Wheeler	From other people.	33:18
Stacey Scales	Okay.	33:18
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm.	33:18
Stacey Scales	Talking to folks?	33:18
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm.	33:18
Tywanna Whorley	What did they tell you?	33:18
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	33:20
Tywanna Whorley	What did they tell you about the Scottsboro Boys?	33:20
Ike Wheeler	Yeah, they tell me about how they got messed up and everything, Scottsboro Boys. In other words, back in those days, I wasn't paying nothing like that much attention anyways.	33:20
Tywanna Whorley	Were you fearful for them?	33:20
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	33:20
Tywanna Whorley	Were you concerned about them?	33:24
Ike Wheeler	Was I concerned about them?	33:24
Tywanna Whorley	Yeah.	33:24
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. I hated it, but it wasn't nothing I could do about it though. That's what it was.	33:24
Tywanna Whorley	Did you think that they were going to be convicted? Did you think that they were going to get convicted?	33:24
Ike Wheeler	Excuse me?	33:24
Stacey Scales	Did you think that they were going to go to jail, or get convicted?	33:24
Ike Wheeler	Go to jail?	33:24
Stacey Scales	Yes, sir.	33:24
Ike Wheeler	I don't know, baby. I didn't take much in it. Back in them days, I didn't take much into it. I was young too. I was young myself. [indistinct 00:34:22], but I remember those Scottsboro Boys though. I remember them, but the wildest thing—Anything else happened, I don't know. I was in the country then, six miles off Mobile Highway.	33:24
Tywanna Whorley	Did you think that they were going to go to jail?	34:35
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	34:35
Tywanna Whorley	Did you think that they were going to go to jail for raping those two women? Did you think that they were going to go to jail for that? You didn't think they were going to get out?	34:35
Ike Wheeler	Raping is a bad name, baby. Do you know that?	34:51
Tywanna Whorley	Mm-hmm.	34:51
Ike Wheeler	That's something bad. They say here to you—Now if you don't do what I ask you, I ain't got no business trying to rape you. You know who you want, you know who you don't want. See, that was wrong. That's just as far wrong as east is from the west. They should have sent them to jail and everywhere else, where they wanted. They could have been my wife or your wife, or anybody. Or your children or something. That's wrong.	34:55
Tywanna Whorley	Did you believe the two women?	35:21
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	35:21
Tywanna Whorley	Did you believe that the two women were telling the truth? Did you believe that the two White women were telling the truth?	35:24
Ike Wheeler	[indistinct 00:35:30]	35:28
Stacey Scales	No, did you believe it happened? That they did it?	35:30
Ike Wheeler	Yeah, I believe it.	35:31
Tywanna Whorley	Why?	35:31
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	35:31
Tywanna Whorley	Why?	35:31
Ike Wheeler	I just told you, plus it was a nation broadcast thing.	35:31
Tywanna Whorley	Uh-huh.	35:31
Ike Wheeler	Everybody knew about it, it was something happened.	35:31
Tywanna Whorley	Well one of the women said that it didn't happen?	35:43
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	35:47
Tywanna Whorley	One of the women said that they didn't rape them.	35:47
Ike Wheeler	They say they didn't rape them?	36:14
Tywanna Whorley	Yeah. One of the—	36:14
Ike Wheeler	That's what they did. They did something to them. Of course I don't know what they did, but it was a nationwide thing. It was all over the United States. Everybody ain't going to talk about it. You know that? That's the truth. So I don't know whether they raped them, don't know whether they didn't, but I believe something happened.	36:14
Tywanna Whorley	Did you and your buddies talk about it?	36:14
Ike Wheeler	No.	36:14
Tywanna Whorley	No?	36:14
Ike Wheeler	I never cussed or nothing like that. The most I used to cuss, that's as big as it get. And let it die out and leave it alone. Leave it alone. The less you think about it, the colder it'll get. Keep applying it, that pressures it up. It do, that's true.	36:14
Ike Wheeler	My old grandmother told me, always told me, "Tend to your business. You ain't got time to tend to other fellow's business, tend to yours. Take all your time and tend to your own business." I'll tell you something else she told me. "See and don't see, hear and don't hear." You know what that meant?	36:50
Tywanna Whorley	No, sir.	37:05
Ike Wheeler	Stay out of other folk's business. You see somebody there and go, "I seen [indistinct 00:37:26] going so and so," that's broadcasting. I ain't got nothing to do with what he do out there. [indistinct 00:37:31] bother me. Ain't that right? A lot of times, that'll get you in trouble. So I ain't [indistinct 00:37:45], I got this far and nobody never bothered me. I got to be an old man. Yeah, I got to live a while. So I never did nothing to anybody. When I was a child, I act as a child. When I was a man, I act as a man.	37:12
Stacey Scales	Did you ever do any traveling around?	38:03
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	38:03
Stacey Scales	Did you go any other places, travel?	38:09
Ike Wheeler	No. Yeah, I went to Michigan.	38:11
Stacey Scales	Yeah?	38:13
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. Michigan. Stayed up there a while, had some people up there. I just went up there visiting, but when I left Montgomery, I moved right here [indistinct 00:38:33] and I been here ever since.	38:14
Stacey Scales	Did you like Michigan best or Birmingham? How was it up in Michigan?	38:33
Ike Wheeler	It was all right, but I'd rather been here, where I was. I'll tell you, it ain't nothing jumping uptown with them. [indistinct 00:38:44], they good to you.	38:42
Tywanna Whorley	[indistinct 00:38:44]	38:43
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	38:43
Stacey Scales	How did you get up to Michigan?	38:43
Ike Wheeler	I was on a train.	38:43
Stacey Scales	Was it separated then?	38:43
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. White in the front and the Black in the back.	38:43
Stacey Scales	How was the ride?	38:43
Ike Wheeler	The ride was all right. You couldn't tell it was different because you wasn't up there with them. There was barely a difference in the ride.	38:43
Stacey Scales	On the train, did you [indistinct 00:38:44]?	38:43
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	38:43
Stacey Scales	[indistinct 00:38:44] food with you, on the train?	38:43
Ike Wheeler	No, I didn't take it.	38:43
Stacey Scales	They fed you?	38:43
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. They got a dining room and a place in there for you to eat in.	38:43
Stacey Scales	That was separated?	38:43
Ike Wheeler	Huh? Yeah. Mm-hmm.	39:02
Tywanna Whorley	Was the food different?	39:02
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	39:02
Tywanna Whorley	Was the food different? What they fed you as opposed to when they fed the White people?	39:12
Ike Wheeler	Was it different?	39:12
Tywanna Whorley	Yeah.	39:12
Stacey Scales	Yeah.	39:12
Ike Wheeler	I don't know. See these days, I'm in a different place, that's all.	39:12
Tywanna Whorley	Was it [indistinct 00:39:13]—	39:12
Ike Wheeler	Y'all know how it used to be [indistinct 00:39:13] White folks.	39:13
Stacey Scales	[indistinct 00:39:13].	39:13
Ike Wheeler	Hm? Mm-hmm.	39:13
Tywanna Whorley	Were your conductors Black?	39:17
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	39:17
Tywanna Whorley	The conductors of the train, were they Black?	39:20
Ike Wheeler	White.	39:21
Tywanna Whorley	White?	39:21
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm.	39:21
Tywanna Whorley	And they treated you okay?	39:21
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	39:36
Tywanna Whorley	They treated you okay?	39:39
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Do you know how that act? About how a person treat you? The way you do. The way you do. You start right, end right. I went in the plant and went to working down there. A lot of the men play with those White folks, kicking corners and—Remember I told you about that? I said, "I don't play." I said, "I played when I was a child." I said, "I don't play." And he told somebody else that, [indistinct 00:40:45]. "Hell no, I don't play. I'm grown." Start right, what happen? You end right. [indistinct 00:40:55]. I ain't [indistinct 00:40:57].	40:22
Tywanna Whorley	When you went over there to work, who did you go talk to [indistinct 00:41:05]	40:52
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	40:52
Stacey Scales	How did you get your job? Who did you talk to over there at the plant?	41:06
Ike Wheeler	[indistinct 00:41:10] hiring back in the day. I went out there to get [indistinct 00:41:15] asked me to [indistinct 00:41:18] said, "Well, wait a minute. What's your name?" Took my name. Said, "Wait a minute, Wheeler." He said, "I'll tell you what." He said, "You go home and come back in the morning, it may be a chance for you." I stayed on [indistinct 00:41:32] then. [indistinct 00:41:34]. I been down there every since, until my retirement.	41:10
Stacey Scales	What did you do inside of the plant?	41:28
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	41:28
Stacey Scales	What did you do?	41:42
Ike Wheeler	Crane helper.	41:43
Stacey Scales	Crane helper?	41:44
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm.	41:44
Stacey Scales	The whole time there, you did that?	41:44
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm. But it was good people. But see, you used to [indistinct 00:41:55] right with them. "Yeah, and so on so on and so on," that stuff don't work. Yeah I told them. [indistinct 00:42:06] with Whites, I—He was a foreman down there.	41:50
Stacey Scales	What's the crane?	41:58
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	41:58
Stacey Scales	What's the crane?	41:58
Ike Wheeler	Where they load cars with. It got a bucket on it. You don't know what—It got a long [indistinct 00:42:17] on it. The man run it, go around just like that. Go around just like that. Go around and get it, pick it up and put it in the cars, like that. It run on the track, out there just like a train would.	42:12
Stacey Scales	Yeah?	42:26
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. Crane.	42:27
Stacey Scales	Is it hard work? Dangerous?	42:28
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	42:33
Stacey Scales	Was it dangerous and hard work?	42:33
Ike Wheeler	No. No. [indistinct 00:42:37] go right there and sit down.	42:34
Tywanna Whorley	What time did you go to work over there?	42:34
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	42:34
Tywanna Whorley	What time did you go to work?	42:34
Ike Wheeler	Seven o'clock. Get off at three, seven to three.	42:47
Stacey Scales	The man in the crane, was he a Black—	42:53
Ike Wheeler	No, he was White.	42:54
Stacey Scales	Oh, yeah.	42:54
Ike Wheeler	White. Wasn't any Black crane owners back in those days.	42:56
Stacey Scales	No?	42:59
Ike Wheeler	No. You could be a helper on the crane back—They used to help on the crane.	43:05
Stacey Scales	Did you see the place change? Did Black folks ever get to get those jobs?	43:05
Ike Wheeler	[indistinct 00:43:06]	43:05
Stacey Scales	Did you see the place change to Black folks get to work to get those other jobs?	43:05
Ike Wheeler	No. They were crane helpers, they never did run a crane.	43:05
Stacey Scales	Never did?	43:05
Ike Wheeler	Uh-uh. They never run an engine. Just switchmen and things like that, [indistinct 00:43:06] switch. They had a White man conducting it, and had a Black switch. [indistinct 00:43:06] work up there, not while I was there.	43:05
Tywanna Whorley	[indistinct 00:43:06]	43:05
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	43:05
Tywanna Whorley	Did you ever make any more than a dollar over there? Did you ever get a raise?	43:05
Ike Wheeler	Did I ever get what?	43:05
Stacey Scales	A raise, more money.	43:05
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. Yeah, I got a raise. Yeah, I got a raise.	43:05
Tywanna Whorley	How much was it?	43:05
Ike Wheeler	I think it's—When I left there, it said $3.20.	43:05
Tywanna Whorley	Three dollars and [indistinct 00:43:06]—	43:05
Ike Wheeler	3.20, I think. I think before I left there, they was paying eight or $9, I think it was.	43:05
Tywanna Whorley	What did you do when you got off of work? Just come straight home?	43:05
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm. On home.	43:05
Tywanna Whorley	[indistinct 00:44:23]	43:05
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	43:07
Tywanna Whorley	[indistinct 00:44:25]	43:07
Ike Wheeler	Retired? No. [indistinct 00:44:29].	43:07
Tywanna Whorley	No?	43:07
Ike Wheeler	[indistinct 00:44:31] like you wanted.	43:07
Tywanna Whorley	[indistinct 00:44:34]	43:07
Ike Wheeler	All this whole quarter, were working in that plant. All these houses were employees in that plant.	43:07
Stacey Scales	What's this thing like [indistinct 00:44:56]	43:07
Ike Wheeler	What's that, son?	43:07
Stacey Scales	[indistinct 00:44:59]	43:07
Ike Wheeler	That's just some junk. A lot of that stuff come from Montgomery.	43:07
Stacey Scales	Oh, really?	43:23
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm. [indistinct 00:45:03] pick up something and bring it. [indistinct 00:45:05] a lot of stuff [indistinct 00:45:07]. A lot of them took it off there.	45:02
Stacey Scales	Really?	45:04
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm.	45:04
Stacey Scales	[indistinct 00:45:10]	45:04
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. [indistinct 00:45:11]to take it off.	45:10
Stacey Scales	Right.	45:11
Ike Wheeler	I was out at the church one Sunday, and they just came in and took the picture of me.	45:16
Stacey Scales	Who took a picture of you?	45:17
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. At this church out here.	45:17
Stacey Scales	You did?	45:17
Ike Wheeler	No, I didn't take it.	45:17
Stacey Scales	Somebody took it?	45:17
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. Yeah, [indistinct 00:45:25] church out there [indistinct 00:45:26]. Said, "Mr. Wheeler?" "Yes, ma'am." "Come here." [indistinct 00:45:26] "You don't know what that is, do you?" I said, "I don't know." I say, "It come out of your yard." Yes. I said, "Okay."	45:26
Stacey Scales	Would you mind if we took a picture of you?	45:29
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	45:29
Stacey Scales	Would you mind if we took a picture [indistinct 00:45:40]?	45:29
Ike Wheeler	[indistinct 00:45:40]	45:29
Stacey Scales	Yeah.	45:29
Ike Wheeler	You know I wouldn't. Why you [indistinct 00:45:40] that much now. [indistinct 00:45:40] took it off there.	45:29
Stacey Scales	All right. Did you make that yourself, or did people in your family do stuff like that?	45:39
Ike Wheeler	Did I make it?	46:06
Stacey Scales	Did your dad or anybody else put things together [indistinct 00:46:12]—	46:08
Ike Wheeler	No. I took that up myself.	46:11
Stacey Scales	You took that up yourself?	46:11
Ike Wheeler	Yeah.	46:11
Stacey Scales	[indistinct 00:46:15]	46:11
Ike Wheeler	[indistinct 00:46:15] myself.	46:11
Tywanna Whorley	Is that the only one you have?	46:11
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	46:11
Tywanna Whorley	Is that the only you that you have?	46:11
Stacey Scales	Do you have more than this?	46:11
Ike Wheeler	Like this?	46:11
Stacey Scales	Do you have any other ones, other than that?	46:11
Ike Wheeler	No. No, no. Uh-uh. My home was in Montgomery. I would go down there and pick up those things where I used to live down at, bring them back here. Bring them on [indistinct 00:46:36] posts in the ground, stick them up there. Have something to do.	46:29
Tywanna Whorley	How did you put things together?	46:42

Stacey Scales	How did you put that all together? How'd you make it?	0:04
Ike Wheeler	What? [indistinct 00:00:10] all of them?	0:09
Stacey Scales	Yes, sir.	0:10
Ike Wheeler	They was already good. I was painting them.	0:10
Stacey Scales	Oh, okay.	0:10
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. The guy told me, put me some hangers on them when—	0:18
Stacey Scales	Oh, so wires?	0:18
Ike Wheeler	Yeah, some wires. Let them hang on them wires. That's where they are. Just hanging on there. Then they got so bad I run a chain through a lot of them and put the wires on them. Mm-hmm. I brought them things out of Montgomery. See, that was my home. I used to go down there and pick them up down there, drag them down there. There was a lot more than that on there. There was. They're gone.	0:20
Tywanna Whorley	Did you travel back and forth to Montgomery once you came to Birmingham?	0:48
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	0:48
Stacey Scales	Did you go back to Montgomery a lot after you came here?	0:51
Ike Wheeler	Oh, yeah. I was always going back down there. Mm-hmm. Yeah. I ain't been down in a good while, though, now. It's been a good while since I've been down there. Yeah, I used to go down there every other week.	1:00
Stacey Scales	Where'd you stay when you went down there?	1:08
Ike Wheeler	Stayed down there with my auntie.	1:11
Stacey Scales	Oh, yeah?	1:11
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm. I have peoples down there.	1:11
Stacey Scales	How'd you get there?	1:15
Ike Wheeler	In my car.	1:16
Stacey Scales	What kind of car did you have?	1:17
Ike Wheeler	Yeah. At first I had a Buick. I also had a Ford. I [indistinct 00:01:22] a car here now.	1:18
Stacey Scales	Do you remember what year the vehicle was?	1:26
Ike Wheeler	No, I sure don't know.	1:27
Stacey Scales	Okay.	1:27
Tywanna Whorley	Do you remember what color it was?	1:41
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	1:42
Tywanna Whorley	Do you remember what color your Buick was? Do you remember what color the car was?	1:42
Ike Wheeler	The color of the car?	1:42
Tywanna Whorley	The color of it. Do you remember the color of it?	1:42
Ike Wheeler	Of the Buick?	1:46
Tywanna Whorley	Uh-huh.	1:46
Ike Wheeler	Yellow.	1:46
Tywanna Whorley	Yellow?	1:46
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm. Yellow Buick. Mm-hmm.	1:48
Tywanna Whorley	Did you buy him in Birmingham?	1:49
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	1:49
Tywanna Whorley	Did you buy the car here in Birmingham?	1:49
Ike Wheeler	Yes, ma'am. Bought it in Birmingham. Now who I got it from, I forgot who he was, where I got it from. I bought it from a man. I forgot what his name.	1:49
Tywanna Whorley	Was it a lot?	1:49
Ike Wheeler	Hm?	1:49
Tywanna Whorley	How much did you pay for it?	1:49
Ike Wheeler	I even forgot that it's been so long. Like a couple hundred dollars I think.	1:49
Tywanna Whorley	Did you save the money up, or did you pay on it monthly, or did you—	1:49
Ike Wheeler	Monthly.	2:19
Tywanna Whorley	Monthly?	2:19
Ike Wheeler	Mm-hmm. Ooh.	2:19
Tywanna Whorley	You okay?	2:19
Ike Wheeler	Ooh. It feels like them pains way down in that foot. The leg cut off up here, you feel like it's down in there, too.	2:32
Stacey Scales	How did that happen?	2:33
Ike Wheeler	Huh?	2:33
Stacey Scales	How did that—	2:33
Ike Wheeler	It's just pain, yeah. It run down there, it feels like it's down there, but it can't. The leg cut off [indistinct 00:02:51]. They do that sometime.	2:33
Tywanna Whorley	How did that happen? Your leg.	2:51
Ike Wheeler	They had to take it off.	2:54
Tywanna Whorley	Gangrene?	2:55
Ike Wheeler	I don't know. I just hurt it or something or other. I had to go to the hospital for heart surgery. See, I've been cut open. Yeah, all around there cut open. I come home. I couldn't stand to be in [indistinct 00:03:12]. So I had to go back. So they told me they had to take it off, couldn't get no circulation through it, and so they had to take it off. It's cut off right along here. All there. It's just sitting in there. [indistinct 00:03:27] up there. But I thank the Lord it wasn't here. I think.	3:02
Tywanna Whorley	Thank you.	3:27

Item Info

Title:

Ike Wheeler interview recording, 1994 June 22

Date:

June 22, 1994

Creator:

Wheeler, Ike

Contributor:

Whorley, Tywanna

Description:

Name: Ike Wheeler; Date of birth: 1922-03-01; Place of birth: Montgomery, AL; Occupation(s): manufacturing; Residence: Birmingham, AL [?]
Informant ID: 754; Interviewed by: Tywanna Whorley.

Occupation:

Manufacturing

Location:

Format:

Language:

English

Digital Collection:

Behind the Veil

Source Collection:

Behind the Veil: Documenting African American Life in the Jim Crow South interviews, photographs, and project records, circa 1864-2011, bulk 1990-2004

Series:

Related Resources:

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Provenance:

The David M. Rubenstein Rare Book and Manuscript Library acquired the Records of the Behind the Veil Oral History Project from the Duke University Center for Documentary Studies in 1997, 1998, 2000, and 2002.

Rights:

Limited Re-Use

CC BY-NC 4.0

Rights Note:

Copyright for content created by the Behind the Veil project is held by Duke University and made available to the public using a Creative Commons Attribution / Non-commercial (CC-BY-NC) license.

Identifier:

RL00170-CS-0383
56bf2bb5-65fa-422c-ba6f-c8244131b400
behindtheveil
1e8036ba-7ca6-4293-8670-046fb4ed2a8d
ark:/87924/r4ns0z65k
1e8036ba-7ca6-4293-8670-046fb4ed2a8d

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Ike Wheeler interview recording, 1994 June 22

Transcript

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1. Ike Wheeler administrative file, 1994

John Hope Franklin Research Center

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Ike Wheeler interview recording, 1994 June 22

Transcript

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John Hope Franklin Research Center

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