Melvenia Durall interview recording, 1994 July 22

Download
- Rights
- Limited Re-Use
  CC BY-NC 4.0
  More Rights Info
- Files (3)
- MP3 Part 1
- MP3 Part 2
- MP3 Part 3
- Please be patient with media downloads. They are often large files.
Share

Embed Code
<iframe src='https://idn.duke.edu/ark:/87924/r4rj4n40k?embed=true' height='125px' width='100%' frameborder='0' marginwidth='0' marginheight='0' scrolling='no' loading='lazy' allowfullscreen></iframe>
Permalink

https://idn.duke.edu/ark:/87924/r4rj4n40k
Skip to Item Info

Loading the media player...

Files for this Item

Transcript

Transcripts may contain inaccuracies.

Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, that's Michele Mitchell.	0:01
Kate Ellis	Yep.	0:02
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, I thought that was the [indistinct 00:00:05].	0:03
Kate Ellis	Would you state your name and when you were born and where you were born?	0:05
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	My name is Melvenia. M-E-L-V-E-N-I-A.	0:12
Kate Ellis	V-E?	0:18
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. N-I-A.	0:20
Kate Ellis	Oh, N-I-A. Okay.	0:21
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	L. That's my middle name is L, initial is L. P-O-L-K is my maiden name.	0:22
Kate Ellis	Oh.	0:29
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And Durall is my marriage.	0:30
Kate Ellis	Which is?	0:32
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	D-U-R-A-L-L.	0:33
Kate Ellis	Okay. I'm just going to check that. The most exciting part of the interview.	0:36
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah. That's all right.	0:42
Kate Ellis	This is Kate Ellis on, July 22nd, 1994 with Mrs. Melvenia Durall. And we're going to start with the family history and then talk. So what's your address?	0:43
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	308 Johnson.	1:00
Kate Ellis	Johnson. When I looked at the map, I saw there's a Johnston. That's what you'd been saying, could be [indistinct 00:01:10].	1:03
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah, there's a difference. Right.	1:10
Kate Ellis	Okay.	1:11
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	New Iberia.	1:13
Kate Ellis	New Iberia, Louisiana.	1:14
Kate Ellis	And what's your zip?	1:16
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	70560.	1:17
Kate Ellis	And when were you born?	1:21
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	December 1st, 1924.	1:24
Kate Ellis	And where were you born?	1:31
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Loreauville. L-O-R-E-A-U-V-I-L-L-E. Louisiana.	1:32
Kate Ellis	Okay. Do you know what Parish that's in?	1:38
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Iberia. It's nine miles from here.	1:42
Kate Ellis	Right. Okay. Iberia Parish. What's been your principal occupation?	1:46
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Teacher.	1:55
Kate Ellis	Teacher. Okay. Teacher. Kids are so cool.	1:56
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	The kids, wait, maybe I need to shut that door.	2:02
Kate Ellis	That's fine. Yeah, that's fine. Okay. And how would you like your name to appear in written documents?	2:16
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Now you know I had to have a name change.	2:21
Kate Ellis	You did? When?	2:26
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	In 1985, I sent for my birth certificate and my original name was Roberta.	2:27
Kate Ellis	Okay.	2:36
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	When I sent for the birth certificate, I'll get ready to retire. I retired. Let me see. I sent for it actually in 1984. The thing, my dad was still living, so I had to get a document from him. But with my birth certificate, all they did was draw a line through Roberta and they put Melvenia.	2:40
Kate Ellis	On the certificate that you received in the mail?	3:05
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I now have, yes.	3:08
Kate Ellis	What did you do? Did you call them and say, "Roberta's not my name?"	3:09
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I did. Well, I went to the courts. I had to change it in the courts.	3:12
Kate Ellis	How did they put down Roberta in the first place?	3:18
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well, I was delivered by a midwife. And those midwives be to— No doubt, another baby had my name.	3:20
Kate Ellis	Oh. So they confused the names.	3:31
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And they just got the name confused.	3:32
Kate Ellis	So it's the midwife that fills out the birth certificate?	3:34
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. During that time.	3:38
Kate Ellis	And what? Do they take it to the [indistinct 00:03:41]?	3:39
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	They send it.	3:41
Kate Ellis	They send it in.	3:41
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	They send it in. Yes. It's like the doctors. Now, my son was delivered by a doctor.	3:42
Kate Ellis	At home or hospital?	3:53
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	At home. He was never registered. The doctor forgot to send his name in, period.	3:54
Kate Ellis	So he does not have a birth certificate.	3:59
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	He didn't have one. So when I wrote for it, they sent and told me they didn't have one. My husband either. My husband was ready to retire. He had never been registered either.	4:01
Kate Ellis	Oh, you're kidding.	4:12
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	They do those things, they forget and so forth. Well, I was registered, but under the wrong name. So I had that. It's changed officially now.	4:12
Kate Ellis	Yeah. Was it a White doctor who forgot?	4:22
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	4:25
Kate Ellis	I mean, I hate to ask this, but do you think that that was something White doctors are more likely to forget when their—	4:26
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	It was a long— My son was born and he was born in 1947.	4:33
Kate Ellis	Your son was?	4:36
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. And this was a White doctor.	4:37
Kate Ellis	Do you think that the doctor was neglectful or do you think he just raised—	4:40
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I think he just forgot. He was kind. Yeah. He was very nice. No, it was a nice guys.	4:44
Kate Ellis	It wasn't like a— Yeah.	4:48
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay. And then the baby was delivered at home and my mother was in LPN.	4:51
Kate Ellis	Wow.	4:58
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And so she knew the doctor and they'd come and sit and drink coffee and everything. They had a good time while I was there [indistinct 00:05:08].	4:58
Kate Ellis	In labor.	5:08
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	In labor, honey. Was drinking coffee. They were talking and going on, but it was just an oversight. It wasn't anything malicious with that doctor.	5:10
Kate Ellis	Oh, well that's good. I had to ask that if that was some sort of—	5:18
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah.	5:22
Kate Ellis	I'm sure there's plenty of ways that—	5:23
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. That could've happened.	5:23
Kate Ellis	—To tell you that White people did.	5:25
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes.	5:26
Kate Ellis	Did sort of do some stuff, but good. That's nice that she knew.	5:27
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, yes.	5:37
Kate Ellis	Its kind of reassuring.	5:37
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah. She had worked with Dr. Edmond. Oh yeah. You knew him very well.	5:37
Kate Ellis	Dr. Edmond?	5:39
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Edmond Landry.	5:39
Kate Ellis	Edmond Landry.	5:40
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	5:42
Kate Ellis	Okay. So as far as how I should put your name down for again, for the official record, should it be Melvenia?	5:44
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes. That it.	5:51
Kate Ellis	Melvenia P Durall.	5:55
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Durall. You can put—	5:55
Kate Ellis	Polk Durall or how do you like it?	5:57
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I usually sign Melvenia P Durall.	6:00
Kate Ellis	Okay.	6:03
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well you can put Polk though.	6:04
Kate Ellis	Put Polk?	6:08
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah. Put Polk. That's how my diploma is.	6:09
Kate Ellis	Oh, okay. You're not in any way related to Matthew Polk are you?	6:16
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	First cousin.	6:20
Kate Ellis	Oh, okay. Okay. Yeah, he's the one that told me to call you, actually.	6:21
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, okay.	6:25
Kate Ellis	Yeah.	6:25
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	First cousins, brother's children.	6:28
Kate Ellis	Okay. Okay. While these questions repeat themselves, I'm just going to— Oh, so you're going to have a birthday. You're going to be 70.	6:37
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	70.	6:48
Kate Ellis	Wow, you look great.	6:49
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	70. Ooh.	6:49
Kate Ellis	You do. That's great.	6:50
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	70. Isn't that something?	6:53
Kate Ellis	I think that's wonderful.	6:59
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I told my niece, I have a niece here visiting from Texas, and I said, "Did you know in December, I'm going to be 70?" She said, "I can't believe that."	6:59
Kate Ellis	Yeah.	7:12
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I said, "Oh, but I can't believe it really," because, but you know what? I have to really slow myself down because I forget.	7:15
Kate Ellis	Do you?	7:20
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I have that age because I have a pace that I keep. And sometimes I say, "Well, I better sit down, I'm getting too old to do some of that."	7:21
Kate Ellis	Yeah. But don't you think your body will tell you when it's too tired?	7:32
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I think so. It does because sometime it does tell me.	7:35
Kate Ellis	It says, "That's enough."	7:40
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Kill [indistinct 00:07:44] and stop hold it.	7:42
Kate Ellis	Yeah. So you're married, right?	7:45
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes.	7:49
Kate Ellis	Okay.	7:49
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	My husband's name?	7:49
Kate Ellis	Yes, please.	7:52
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	J-A-K-E. Jake.	7:52
Kate Ellis	Jake. Does he have a middle name?	7:54
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Jake Joseph.	7:57
Kate Ellis	Joseph.	7:59
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Durall. Junior. Now he's a junior.	7:59
Kate Ellis	And when was he born?	8:06
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	February 5th, '25. I'm two months older than he is. February.	8:09
Kate Ellis	Don't you let him forget it.	8:15
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	25. I let him know who's older.	8:16
Kate Ellis	My mother and her husband always have that running joke. She's, I think, three weeks. Oh, but they have it the other way. She's three weeks younger than he is. And she says, "I'm his younger woman."	8:21
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Cute.	8:35
Kate Ellis	Okay. Where was he born?	8:36
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Here, New Iberia.	8:38
Kate Ellis	Iberia.	8:39
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Iberia, Louisiana in this neighborhood.	8:41
Kate Ellis	Really?	8:45
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	We moved here. Now this is the only neighborhood I know because we moved here when I was two.	8:46
Kate Ellis	To this neighborhood?	8:52
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	8:53
Kate Ellis	So you grew up in the same neighborhood?	8:53
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	8:54
Kate Ellis	Did you know each other all your lives?	8:55
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.	8:57
Kate Ellis	Really? Since when? How old were you when you—	8:59
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh Lord. Since I can remember—	9:01
Kate Ellis	Really?	9:04
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	— We knew each other.	9:05
Kate Ellis	Oh, wow. Oh, that's a story. What is his occupation?	9:07
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	He's a retired contract mail carrier. And he did—	9:11
Kate Ellis	Now, did you say contract mail carrier?	9:17
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mail carrier. Yeah. He used to carry mail from the post office, and bus driver.	9:20
Kate Ellis	Okay. Carrier and bus driver. So you don't have to answer the question, but when did you start dating? I mean, if you'd known each other most of your life?	9:26
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, in high school.	9:39
Kate Ellis	Mm-hmm. Wow.	9:40
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	We dated in high school and didn't matter much to my [indistinct 00:09:47] we get the most stuff now, then we still get the stuff.	9:42
Kate Ellis	You what? I'm sorry?	9:47
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	We still get into all kinds of misunderstandings.	9:47
Kate Ellis	It's funny how you can know somebody all your life.	10:01
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	All your life. Yeah. You know them too. Too well.	10:02
Kate Ellis	Really?	10:02
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh yeah. We dated through the years, but it was from high school.	10:04
Kate Ellis	Wow. That's great. What was your mother's name?	10:10
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Virginia, V-I-R Well, you how to spell it.	10:15
Kate Ellis	Virginia. Does she—	10:19
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	She was a Porter. Her maiden name.	10:21
Kate Ellis	Her main name is a Porter?	10:22
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Porter. P-O-R-T-E-R.	10:24
Kate Ellis	What about her middle name?	10:24
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I don't think my mother had a middle name. No.	10:29
Kate Ellis	Okay. And so, I always [indistinct 00:10:35]. And so she was a a Polk? She was Virginia—	10:31
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Porter, P-O-R-T-E-R.	10:37
Kate Ellis	Oh, right. Okay.	10:39
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And she married a Polk. Her maiden name is Porter, and her last name is Polk. Now she's from St. Martin Parish.	10:39
Kate Ellis	That's where she was born?	10:49
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. St. Martin Parish.	10:49
Kate Ellis	When was she born?	10:56
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Lord, I got to figure that out.	11:00
Kate Ellis	Well, let's see. Is she still alive?	11:02
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	No, my mother's dead.	11:04
Kate Ellis	Okay. Well, I can help you. Do you remember how old she was when she died?	11:06
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	She was 58 in 1967.	11:09
Kate Ellis	Okay.	11:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's why I say I had to figure that out because I couldn't work it out.	11:16
Kate Ellis	So she was born in nine— Yeah, she was born in 1909. Does that sound right to you? She was 58 in 1967. Yeah, so 1909. And when did she pass?	11:21
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	August 26th, 1967.	11:33
Kate Ellis	August, 1967.	11:35
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	26, '67.	11:41
Kate Ellis	And what did she do?	11:45
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	She was an LPN, registered LPN. And my dad, Washington, W-A-S-H-I-N-G-T-O-N.	11:47
Kate Ellis	Did he have a middle name?	11:59
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	No. P-O-L-K.	12:00
Kate Ellis	Okay. And when was—	12:05
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Now, let me see. He was born— I got to figure that out too. He died in 1985 and he was 96.	12:06
Kate Ellis	Oh.	12:15
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah. He lived a long time. And he was 20 years older than my mother.	12:17
Kate Ellis	Yeah, wow. Okay. Kate, let's see.	12:21
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I think it's 89.	12:26
Kate Ellis	So that would be— Yeah.	12:28
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	89. I think it was. 1889.	12:30
Kate Ellis	Yep. Yeah.	12:30
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I have to always figure that. He died when he was 96. And he died March 15th, 1985. Now he was just a laborer.	12:35
Kate Ellis	Okay.	12:49
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	L-A-B.	12:50
Kate Ellis	Where did he work as a laborer?	12:51
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	He worked on the pipelines. One time he worked at the Salt Mine, Jefferson Island Salt Mine. And he also worked as a night watchman. And he also helped to build the spillway from Walton City to Port Barry. That's the type of work he did.	12:54
Kate Ellis	So he did some hard work. Where was he born?	13:23
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Loreauville.	13:24
Kate Ellis	Okay.	13:25
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	L-O-R-E-A-U-V-I-L-L-E.	13:27
Kate Ellis	Okay.	13:37
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I have two children.	13:38
Kate Ellis	Okay. What are their names?	13:40
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I have a son, Jake III. Jake Joseph III.	13:43
Kate Ellis	I like that name. Joseph—	13:45
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	The third. I remember the sisters change his name to Jacob.	13:46
Kate Ellis	The what?	13:56
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	The sisters, the nuns.	13:58
Kate Ellis	Oh.	14:01
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	He's Catholic. My husband's Catholic. I'm [indistinct 00:14:02]. He changed his name to Jacob. The biggest mess. Then he had to go back when he got ready to go to the service. That's the funniest thing I don't understand it. They called him to the service and he had never been registered. But the Parish had him listed. I don't— And he went to the service and that's when he had to change his name back because he used to go on Jacob and he had to change his—	14:01
Kate Ellis	Why did he have to change it back, because they didn't recognize him?	14:26
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well, you see his dad, he was named after his dad. And his dad was J-A-K-E. So he had to put J-A-K-E.	14:29
Kate Ellis	Oh, that's [indistinct 00:14:40]. When was he born? I know you told me.	14:35
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	My son?	14:42
Kate Ellis	Yeah.	14:43
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	March 6th, '57. '47, I'm sorry. Oh, '47.	14:43
Kate Ellis	That's okay. So was he born in New Iberia?	14:48
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	New Iberia.	14:54
Kate Ellis	And your other child?	14:55
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Nedra. N-E-D-R-A. Faye, F-A-Y-E. Parham. P-A-R-H-A-M. That's from Atlanta. Her husband.	15:00
Kate Ellis	Her husband is—	15:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Her husband is from Atlanta, and she was born December 25th, 1956. Christmas.	15:14
Kate Ellis	In New Iberia.	15:24
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	New Iberia.	15:25
Kate Ellis	Okay. What about, do you have brothers and sister? Well, yeah.	15:28
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, yeah.	15:33
Kate Ellis	Can you tell me the names of your brothers and sisters?	15:34
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Living?	15:35
Kate Ellis	Both living and dead.	15:37
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay. All right. I have Washington Polk Junior.	15:38
Kate Ellis	Junior. And when was he born?	15:46
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, God. I don't know.	15:48
Kate Ellis	I know these are vexing questions. They always kind of— Let's see.	15:50
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	His birthday is March 4th, I know, but I don't remember the year he was born.	15:55
Kate Ellis	And he's still alive?	16:00
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, he's still alive.	16:02
Kate Ellis	Do you know how old?	16:03
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh yeah. He's 83.	16:04
Kate Ellis	Okay. And we're nine—	16:04
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I think he's 83.	16:07
Kate Ellis	Isn't that, am I right that that'd be 1911?	16:09
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Uh-huh. They should be, yeah. 1911.	16:11
Kate Ellis	Okay. And he was born in?	16:15
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	[indistinct 00:16:19].	16:17
Kate Ellis	In?	16:19
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Loreauville.	16:19
Kate Ellis	Okay.	16:20
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And you know, all that is documented, but I don't have that written.	16:22
Kate Ellis	What do you mean?	16:27
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah, the churches.	16:29
Kate Ellis	Oh, the church has it. Uh-huh.	16:30
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Myrtle Butler, that's my sister.	16:31
Kate Ellis	Now is it M-Y-R-	16:34
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	R-T-L-E.	16:35
Kate Ellis	What's her second name? Buttle?	16:37
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Polk. P-O-L-K. And then, and Butler is a marriage name.	16:38
Kate Ellis	Okay. And her—	16:44
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Her birthday— Wait a minute.	16:46
Kate Ellis	Oh, let me take this off here.	16:48
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay. Yeah, look at this.	16:52
Kate Ellis	Okay.	16:54
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Is it on?	16:54
Kate Ellis	It's on. Yeah. Well, I just sort of keep it on. And that was in Loreauville?	16:54
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Loreauville. And I have a brother, Merlin, M-E-R-L-I-N.	17:06
Kate Ellis	And he was born?	17:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	July the 21st, I think it is. Not two years from—	17:18
Kate Ellis	From Myrtle?	17:35
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	17:35
Kate Ellis	1920.	17:35
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	About 1920. Uh-huh.	17:35
Kate Ellis	And then?	17:35
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay, then I'll come. Then my brother who is deceased, you just can put it. Sydney, S-I-D-N-E-Y-B, that's his middle initial. Polk. November 22nd, 1926.	17:37
Kate Ellis	And when did he pass?	18:00
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	October, 1969.	18:03
Kate Ellis	Hmm. Let's see. So he was in his mid forties.	18:07
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Uh-huh. 43, I think he was.	18:22
Kate Ellis	Oh dear.	18:29
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay. Now, Robert.	18:30
Kate Ellis	Polk?	18:36
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Uh-huh. January the 14th, 1931. I got to think about that. Hope I'm getting them right.	18:36
Kate Ellis	If it's close, that's fine.	18:51
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay. Elaine Campbell. Now she has his middle initials.	18:53
Kate Ellis	She does?	19:03
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. Elaine, D R.	19:04
Kate Ellis	D R. Okay.	19:10
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And her maiden name, of course, is Polk. February 26th, '33. It's funny, nobody told you to go to her because she's the one—	19:10
Kate Ellis	They did. And I actually called her and she said that she might do an interview with me and that she's really busy.	19:27
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah. So she's really, she is busy.	19:35
Kate Ellis	Yeah.	19:37
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	So call her again because she got a wealth of information.	19:38
Kate Ellis	Okay. I'll call her.	19:40
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's my sister.	19:40
Kate Ellis	Okay. Is that it?	19:40
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's it.	19:40
Kate Ellis	Okay. Okay. How many grandchildren do you have?	19:48
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Three.	19:50
Kate Ellis	Okay. And that's all [indistinct 00:19:54]. Moving right along, I need to list the places, just the cities or towns, whatever, that you have lived in. Have you lived here all your life? Right, okay. So I'm going to say New Iberia.	19:52
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	New Iberia.	20:06
Kate Ellis	[indistinct 00:20:09].	20:06
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I was born in Loreauville, but I didn't ever really live there.	20:10
Kate Ellis	From 1924 to present. That's easy. Okay. Now I need your education history. The names of all the schools that you've attended.	20:18
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Graduate of Iberia Parish Training School.	20:34
Kate Ellis	Okay. Now, was that elementary as well, that go all through from Kindergarten?	20:38
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	All the way through? Yeah.	20:45
Kate Ellis	Did you have Kindergarten?	20:47
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	No, we had prema.	20:48
Kate Ellis	Okay, prema. But, okay. So then it's Iberia?	20:52
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Parish Training School, prema through 11th grade.	20:53
Kate Ellis	Okay. So you didn't get the 12th grade, huh?	20:59
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	No, no. We had the prema and then we had first through 11.	21:00
Kate Ellis	Now, what age were you when you started prema? Were you—?	21:06
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I finished at 17 and I had gone 12 years.	21:12
Kate Ellis	Okay. So you started when you were five. Reason I to write down the date. So you were there from 1929.	21:18
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	To '43.	21:23
Kate Ellis	To '43. So you got a high school diploma at the end?	21:28
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	21:30
Kate Ellis	Okay.	21:30
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Southern University of Baton Rouge, Bachelor of Science, 1950.	21:37
Kate Ellis	Bachelor of Science?	21:54
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	21:55
Kate Ellis	Okay.	21:57
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Texas Southern University in Houston. I did for the study that I didn't get a degree in '53.	21:58
Kate Ellis	1953. Was a year of study, did you say?	22:06
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Summer.	22:16
Kate Ellis	A summer of study. Okay. Okay. In what?	22:16
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Hmm?	22:20
Kate Ellis	In education?	22:22
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	22:23
Kate Ellis	Okay.	22:23
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I was a gym teacher.	22:24
Kate Ellis	Oh, okay.	22:26
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Now, University of Southwestern.	22:28
Kate Ellis	And that's in—	22:33
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Lafayette.	22:34
Kate Ellis	Lafayette of Southwestern Louisiana.	22:35
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. That's Lafayette, Louisiana. 1970. I got a degree in Administration and Supervision.	22:37
Kate Ellis	1970?	22:50
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	'70, uh-huh. Degree in Administration and Supervision.	22:55
Kate Ellis	Okay. Okay, great.	23:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's it.	23:14
Kate Ellis	Okay. Now I need your work history, the current, and— Are you retired?	23:16
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I'm retired. Okay. Now the schools I worked at? You need that?	23:22
Kate Ellis	Yeah, no. You've been a teacher the whole time, is that right?	23:27
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	23:29
Kate Ellis	Okay. Well, let me ask you this. If they're all Iberia Parish public schools, then that's what I would write down.	23:29
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	They're all Iberia.	23:38
Kate Ellis	As opposed to listing—	23:39
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	The schools.	23:40
Kate Ellis	— Each one.	23:40
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Iberia Parish Schools.	23:40
Kate Ellis	Iberia Parish. Am I right to call it Iberia Parish Public Schools? Or do I say—	23:42
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. Public schools. Yeah, public schools.	23:51
Kate Ellis	And from what year did you start teaching?	23:56
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	'52, '53 to 1985. I retired May 31st, 1985.	24:00
Kate Ellis	That's long service. Okay. Is there anything else that you— I mean, I'm just saying teacher Iberian Parish public schools, '52 to '85. Does that cover it?	24:27
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah. Now I did teach veterans.	24:34
Kate Ellis	You taught veterans?	24:37
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	At night in Iberia Parish.	24:38
Kate Ellis	Okay. Teacher. What would you call their—	24:40
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Let me see. Veterans Adult Education.	24:50
Kate Ellis	Great.	24:55
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. Adult Education. 1950 to '52. Because you see, I didn't work in the public schools, I taught veterans during that time.	24:56
Kate Ellis	So you did that right when you got out of college?	25:15
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	25:15
Kate Ellis	Okay. And that was Iberia Parish.	25:24
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. Iberia Parish.	25:26
Kate Ellis	Okay. Have you received any awards or honors or held any offices?	25:35
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I'm a Worthy Matron of Eastern Stars.	25:53
Kate Ellis	What's it called? The Matron?	25:57
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Uh-huh. WM. Worthy Matron. W-O-R-T-H-Y.	25:58
Kate Ellis	Okay. I'm going to have to ask you this. It's the Matron?	25:58
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Uh-huh. Worthy Matron.	25:59
Kate Ellis	M-A-T-R-O-N. Of the Worthy—	26:10
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	No.	26:15
Kate Ellis	[indistinct 00:26:16].	26:15
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's all right. It should have been right in front of it. Okay.	26:16
Kate Ellis	Worthy Matron.	26:20
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Of Ernest Gullet Chapter. E-R-N-E-S-T.	26:25
Kate Ellis	Ernest.	26:31
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. Gullet. G-U-L-L-E-T. Chapter number 16, Order of Eastern Stars.	26:31
Kate Ellis	Order of Eastern Stars.	26:43
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	26:46
Kate Ellis	Okay.	26:47
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I have been board member and manager. Oh, well, manager and board member of Iberia Parish Federal Credit Union. President of True Friend, T-R-U-E-F-R-I-E-N-D. True friend Benevolent, B-E-N-E-V-O-L-E-N-T, association.	26:48
Kate Ellis	Now, am I right that Matthew Polk's father helped found that association?	27:37
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. He's been president too.	27:41
Kate Ellis	Okay.	27:44
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay. I'm the President, Secretary of Mount Zion Baptist Church. And in parenthesis, put the clerk, I should have put secretary Clerk behind.	27:44
Kate Ellis	Okay.	28:04
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mount Zion Baptist Church. That was from over 40 years.	28:05
Kate Ellis	Oh, now that's the Polks Church, isn't it? In Loreauville?	28:11
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	In Loreauville, yeah.	28:12
Kate Ellis	I'm going to go there this Sunday for the eight o'clock service.	28:14
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh yeah. Well, good. Eight o'clock. Yeah. That's it. I'm the former secretary. I'm not secretary anymore, I give that up. I've gotten awards. I don't usually like to bother with that.	28:18
Kate Ellis	Well, can I look over here? Didn't see a plaque over here?	28:37
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	28:42
Kate Ellis	Certificate of Appreciation.	28:42
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. One class of '60.	28:49
Kate Ellis	60.	28:50
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Uh-huh.	28:52
Kate Ellis	Of JHHS.	28:52
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Uh-huh. Jonas Henderson High School.	28:55
Kate Ellis	Okay.	28:57
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's the school. And then I have that other one over there from— That plaque against the wall?	28:57
Kate Ellis	I see. The friendship?	29:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah.	29:14
Kate Ellis	Oh, okay.	29:15
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And that was given me from the class of what?	29:17
Kate Ellis	It says in memory of Mrs. Dorothy—	29:19
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Babino. And that's the class of what gave me that, I'm trying to think.	29:27
Kate Ellis	It doesn't say.	29:30
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	It doesn't say. Now that's the class of— I'm trying to think of, that was her class. She died and I took care of her and her class gave me that certificate.	29:31
Kate Ellis	Oh, okay.	29:41
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Taking care of her. Good friend of mine.	29:43
Kate Ellis	Huh. Okay.	29:47
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And I took care of her. I got several certificates and plaques in the bag.	29:48
Kate Ellis	You do? Well, I'm going to put the Certificate of Appreciation?	29:56
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Class of '60.	29:59
Kate Ellis	Now, you know what I want to do? This makes me think. I think what I'd like to do is where I put teacher Iberia Parish Public Schools, underneath I want to just write the schools that it was.	30:00
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay.	30:10
Kate Ellis	And I don't need to put the years that you were at each school, but at least, we can list the schools.	30:10
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay.	30:14
Kate Ellis	So would you—	30:15
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay. Iberia Parish Training School. No, Jonas Henderson Senior High school.	30:16
Kate Ellis	Now. Did that—	30:23
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That was a Black school named after Mr. Henderson, father.	30:27
Kate Ellis	JB Henderson's father?	30:31
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah.	30:32
Kate Ellis	Jonas Henderson—	30:32
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Senior High School.	30:34
Kate Ellis	Now, did that used to be Iberia Parish Training School?	30:36
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	A long time ago.	30:40
Kate Ellis	Yes. And so the name changed.	30:42
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Changed.	30:43
Kate Ellis	From that to Jonas Henderson?	30:44
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Right.	30:47
Kate Ellis	Okay. Do you know the year that that school name changed?	30:48
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	'50.	30:51
Kate Ellis	Okay. I'm going to put down here. I ask this because I just think it's important to know, and I'm still sort of trying to get it all straight in my head.	30:51
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes. You see, Iberia Parish Training School was the early name of the Black Public School in this city. Okay. In 1950, when Mr. Henderson became president, they changed the name of the school and named it after his father.	31:02
Kate Ellis	Okay.	31:22
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Jonas.	31:22
Kate Ellis	Okay. When JB Henderson became principal.	31:23
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Principal, they changed it.	31:26
Kate Ellis	They named after his father.	31:28
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	His father.	31:28
Kate Ellis	Okay.	31:29
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Jonas Henderson, who at that time, who prior to that time was a math teacher in this area?	31:29
Kate Ellis	Jonas Henderson.	31:37
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Uh-huh.	31:38
Kate Ellis	And was he just somebody who affected a lot of people and who—	31:39
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes. He then was principal.	31:42
Kate Ellis	[indistinct 00:31:47].	31:45
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Is that my husband?	31:47
Kate Ellis	I don't know.	31:48
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Come on. This is my nephew from Houston.	31:50
Kate Ellis	Oh, hi. Okay. What were you just saying?	31:53
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	It was named after Jonas Henderson.	31:58
Kate Ellis	Oh, right. Okay.	32:00
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Who was the principal of High Institute, a private institution where Mr. Polk and Mr. Henderson finished a Baptist school.	32:01
Kate Ellis	Okay. So that was a Baptist school?	32:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes, it was a Baptist school.	32:15
Kate Ellis	Again, these little things that—	32:16
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	High Institute.	32:18
Kate Ellis	Okay.	32:18
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	It was controlled by the Baptist, the Union Six District Baptist Association.	32:21
Kate Ellis	Oh, Union Six Baptist Association. Okay. And I'm sure I can read more about that, but it's still always nice to have somebody tell it to you. So the How Institute was never a part of IPTS?	32:26
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	No.	32:46
Kate Ellis	Okay.	32:47
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	It was a private school.	32:47
Kate Ellis	Okay.	32:50
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And it was under the auspices of the Union Six District Missionary Baptist Association. See, it was private.	32:52
Kate Ellis	Yeah.	33:00
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Now Mr. Henderson and Mrs Polk finished from that school. That was prior to my time.	33:02
Kate Ellis	Okay, good. Okay. So you taught at Jonas Henderson Senior High School.	33:07
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And New Iberia Freshman High, which was in all ninth grade school. I preferred working with little children.	33:13
Kate Ellis	Really?	33:22
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	The younger ones. The younger ones.	33:23
Kate Ellis	Okay. Now the junior, senior high school. And you said that this was all for Black students?	33:27
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes.	33:32
Kate Ellis	Until 1970?	33:33
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's right. Until the integration.	33:34
Kate Ellis	And same thing with New Liberia Freshman High?	33:36
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	No, no. Freshman High was doing integration.	33:39
Kate Ellis	Oh, okay.	33:41
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay. You see, this went from Jonas Henderson Senior High cease to exist under that name in 1969.	33:41
Kate Ellis	Oh. And that's when they changed it to the street name?	33:57
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	To the street name.	34:01
Kate Ellis	And what was that? And that street name is?	34:02
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Now, they didn't change that one to the street name. They changed it to New Iberia Freshman High and all ninth grade school.	34:04
Kate Ellis	Wait a minute.	34:12
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay.	34:12
Kate Ellis	Okay. The Jonas Henderson Senior High School—	34:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Changed—	34:16
Kate Ellis	To a new Iberia—	34:17
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Freshman High, which housed only ninth graders of the parish.	34:19
Kate Ellis	Well, what happened to those students who would've been—	34:25
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	At senior high? They went to New Iberia Senior High.	34:28
Kate Ellis	Oh.	34:31
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay. You see this And it's still that way. New Iberia Freshman High is all ninth graders. Okay. Now. And New Liberia Senior High's from 10th through 12th.	34:31
Kate Ellis	I see.	34:44
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay. Now.	34:44
Kate Ellis	And so that's how integration.	34:46
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes.	34:47
Kate Ellis	That's what happened after integration.	34:47
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's what happened after integration.	34:48
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Now I understand that, later they planned to make Freshman High, a senior high school again. They never should have done that in the first place because there's too many students in one place. Okay.	34:50
Kate Ellis	Mm-hmm. Yeah. Sounds like it. Okay. So these are the place. This is—	35:03
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's right.	35:09
Kate Ellis	Great.	35:09
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay.	35:09
Kate Ellis	Now, I didn't get finished. I'm going to put this on hold and I'm going to go right down the certificate.	35:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	My True Friend Society. I have a plaque from them in the back.	35:20
Kate Ellis	Okay.	35:25
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And on my retirement, I have plaques from Omicron organization. That's a social club that I belong to.	35:26
Kate Ellis	What's it called?	35:37
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	O-M-I-C-R-O-N. That's a great name.	35:38
Kate Ellis	Omicron.	35:41
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Uh-huh.	35:43
Kate Ellis	Social. What's it Omicron?	35:43
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Civic and Social Club.	35:46
Kate Ellis	What kind of things does that club do?	35:46
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well, we used to present debutantes and we do charitable work. We visit the nursing homes, have bingo games for them. We send baskets. We've made lap robes and we bring articles to the nursing home and so forth.	35:50
Kate Ellis	How long have you been a part of that club?	36:07
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh Lord. 37 some years.	36:09
Kate Ellis	Really?	36:11
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	36:12
Kate Ellis	So from probably around 1960 on?	36:12
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. I guess. Right.	36:14
Kate Ellis	1960 to present.	36:14
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	36:14
Kate Ellis	Actually, I was going to ask you about the Earnest Gullet chapter number 16 Order of Eastern Stars.	36:23
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Of Eastern Stars.	36:30
Kate Ellis	What is that?	36:31
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's a branch of the Masons.	36:31
Kate Ellis	Oh, okay.	36:34
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	You know about the Masonic Lodge? That's the women branch. They're under the jurisdiction of Mason.	36:34
Kate Ellis	Okay. How long have you been a part of that organization?	36:41
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	27 years.	36:44
Kate Ellis	How many?	36:44
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	27. And I've only been leading it for four years. The Worthy Matron is the president.	36:47
Kate Ellis	Oh, all right.	36:54
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's like the president.	36:57
Kate Ellis	Oops. I should say been member of this.	37:03
Kate Ellis	Okay. Other organizations that you have belonged to or do belong to? And that means civic organizations, community, educational, political, any kind of organizations?	37:15
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well, I belong to LRTA. That's the Louisiana Retired Teachers Association. I had almost forgotten all about them.	37:31
Kate Ellis	Mm-hmm.	37:42
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	The National NRT. If you can list the initials, because that's national, widely known. A-A-R-P. When you put that [indistinct 00:38:03].	37:44
Kate Ellis	Oh, okay, AARP, American Association of Retirement.	38:02
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes. A-A-R-P.	38:05
Kate Ellis	Like NAACP, everybody knows about it.	38:08
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Right. And NAACP, I belonged to that too.	38:10
Kate Ellis	Okay.	38:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	My alumni chapter seven, alumni chapter, USL Alumni chapter I owe my dues now.	38:20
Kate Ellis	For which?	38:32
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	USL Alumni Chapter. Let me see what else is there. That's enough.	38:37
Kate Ellis	That's enough.	38:38
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's enough. And I tell you, during the winter now, three of them recessed during the summer. But now with the Federal Credit Union, I have that.	38:49
Kate Ellis	Well, you have it down here as— Yeah. Okay.	39:02
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	The now with that, that I was a manager and all, but I'm not a manager anymore, but I'm on the board and the credit committee.	39:05
Kate Ellis	Okay.	39:17
Kate Ellis	Well, I got here manager, a board member.	39:21
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Of the—	39:23
Kate Ellis	Of Iberian Parish Federal Credit Union.	39:24
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's what I was.	39:27
Kate Ellis	Okay.	39:27
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Now I'm not manager anymore. That's too much trouble. I'm getting too old now. But I do go help.	39:28
Kate Ellis	You do. Okay.	39:34
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I go help, I volunteer for that. And I have worked for the Council on Aging.	39:36
Kate Ellis	Oh, okay. So, I'll put here since [indistinct 00:39:47].	39:44
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Council on Aging. I used to help it with the office work, paperwork in the office. Oh, I don't do that anymore because I had too much.	39:46
Kate Ellis	Yeah. Yeah.	39:57
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I have volunteered with the library too.	39:58
Kate Ellis	Really? Liberia Parish Public Library.	40:01
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	40:10
Kate Ellis	Is it called— Oh no, is it New Liberia Public Library or Liberia Parish Library?	40:10
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I think it's Liberia Parish Public Library. I volunteered that too.	40:17
Kate Ellis	Okay.	40:19
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	For a while. I had to stop because my grandson was young and he would come and that would interrupt my volunteering procedure. And I stopped. Okay.	40:21
Kate Ellis	And then, unless you have something to add to that.	40:34
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's enough.	40:36
Kate Ellis	Then any other activities or affiliations, which is a very broad category, which can include military service, labor, unionizing, hobbies and interests?	40:37
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Hobby.	40:48
Kate Ellis	Yeah.	40:49
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I am a vegetable gardener. I got to show you my garden.	40:50
Kate Ellis	I would love to see your garden.	40:55
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	When you go back, you just take a look on the other side of this house. We have an extra lot there in that garden. I do that.	40:56
Kate Ellis	Oh, you do? Oh, I didn't notice it before because I was in my car, but I'll take a look.	41:06
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	A vegetable garden. And I've been doing that since 1984. And that's present. I love that. And flower gardening is my other hobby. And traveling, of course.	41:10
Kate Ellis	Traveling.	41:36
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's one of my biggest interests.	41:37
Kate Ellis	Is that right?	41:39
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. I love that.	41:41
Kate Ellis	So how far north have you been? You went up to Washington DC?	41:43
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I've been to New York. Well, no, I've been to Canada. That's the furthest, I think, North Haven.	41:47
Kate Ellis	Did you go through New York? Did you drive or did you fly?	41:53
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh no, we drive.	41:56
Kate Ellis	Oh, okay.	41:57
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I went through Canada, through Detroit.	41:58
Kate Ellis	Oh, okay.	42:02
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And I've been Buffalo, New York. That's the furthest. No, but I went to Niagara Falls. I think that would be the furthest point.	42:02
Kate Ellis	Yep. I think it is.	42:11
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Niagara Falls.	42:12
Kate Ellis	I've never been to Niagara Falls.	42:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I've been to Niagara Falls. Canada is the cleanest city that I've been. The farthest south I've been is Mexico City, Mexico. That's the farthest I've been.	42:14
Kate Ellis	Nice.	42:27
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	South Mexico City.	42:27
Kate Ellis	Wow. And then finally, do you have any— Well, we are finished the interview, so it's kind of funny. But it says, any comment you'd like to make a favorite saying or a phrase or a quote?	42:31
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	A favorite saying, "I'd like to do unto others as you would have them do unto you." I learned that as a very young child.	42:43
Kate Ellis	Really?	42:55
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	42:55
Kate Ellis	Okay.	42:55
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's my favorite saying.	42:55
Kate Ellis	Oh, look what we did. That's great. So what's your schedule like now? It's 15:40 PM.	43:06
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh.	43:15
Kate Ellis	I'll put this on pause.	43:18
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm. I did babysitting in the homes when I was real young, and I helped to take care of my younger sisters and brothers.	43:20
Kate Ellis	But you were in the middle of them.	43:31
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	In the middle. So I took care of all the rest—	43:32
Kate Ellis	Wow.	43:35
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	— At the bottom. Plus my nieces and nephews had followed because my sister had children.	43:36
Kate Ellis	Okay. An older sister?	43:43
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	An older sister, Myrtle. I took care of her children and I worked. Now during my early years, I would go to work at 06:30 AM in the morning.	43:44
Kate Ellis	Doing babysitting?	43:57
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Housework. I would do housework. I started working when I was in the sixth grade, I did housework. And I can remember I worked for 25 cents a day during that time. And I would go in the morning from 06:30 AM and work until one in the afternoon.	43:59
Kate Ellis	And then when would you go to school?	44:22
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That was during the summer.	44:24
Kate Ellis	Oh, okay.	44:26
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	During the summer and during the school year, I would go sometimes before school in the mornings and in the afternoons after school, then I would take care of my sisters and brothers. I did the cooking a lot because both parents worked.	44:26
Kate Ellis	Now your mother was an LPN?	44:45
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well, she wasn't then.	44:47
Kate Ellis	What was she doing?	44:48
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	In my early years, she used to cook for Provost Cafe at one time, and she worked for the Iberia General Hospital, but it was called the Old Crawford Hospital at that time. She did cleaning in the hospital. Then that's when she learned to be a nurse's aide. After then, Dr. Crawford got a nurse from Lake Charles that came to teach the Black people, Black ladies who were interested in nursing. And that's how she became an LPN.	44:49
Kate Ellis	I see. So there wasn't any training for them before?	45:40
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	No, not until Dr. Crawford had the Black nurses trained. And I've forgotten what year that was they graduated from the nursing school, but that was a nurse that came from Lake Charles.	45:43
Kate Ellis	Now, was she White?	46:00
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	She was White.	46:01
Kate Ellis	The doctor was White.	46:01
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And the doctor was White. Yes.	46:02
Kate Ellis	Why did he decide to have the Black nurses trained here? I mean, do you know what it is that made him decide that?	46:04
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I guess because they were interested and they had no other outlet of learning. You see, we had no vocational schools or anything in the area because my mother, they'd empty the bed pans and assist the nurses in their duties. And I guess he found out that some of them were very interested. And they were the first Black nurses that graduated. And Mr. Polk wife was one of them.	46:13
Kate Ellis	Is that right?	46:40
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mm-hmm.	46:40
Kate Ellis	I didn't know that.	46:41
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	She was one—	46:41

Kate Ellis	Where did they work? I said the name of the hospital. It was the Old Crawford—	0:01
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Crawford Hospital.	0:05
Kate Ellis	And so this person came from Lake Charles to teach them—	0:06
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Lake Charles, to teach them. A nurse that came in.	0:09
Kate Ellis	Do you know around how old you were when she started this training?	0:11
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I was about 11 or 12.	0:16
Kate Ellis	So this was in the thirties that she got this training?	0:19
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, yeah. The thirties and early forties.	0:24
Kate Ellis	Okay. And so she was one of the first ones that was trained?	0:34
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah. She was one of the first ones. Let me see. Rosa? No. It wasn't the early thirties.	0:36
Kate Ellis	Oh, okay.	0:43
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	It was the early forties.	0:44
Kate Ellis	Oh, okay.	0:44
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Because I can remember now. Rosa was one that was in that. She finished high school in 1945, so it started before 1945. A friend of mine.	0:48
Kate Ellis	Rosa?	1:02
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	She finished. Yeah. She finished in that class, and it had to have been '45.	1:03
Kate Ellis	Now, can I ask you about Old Crawford Hospital, was that a hospital for Whites?	1:11
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And Blacks.	1:16
Kate Ellis	And Blacks. So it served both?	1:17
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes, it served both. It served both. Well, you know there was a special area for Blacks and a special area for Whites. Now, we had a hospital here, that was Dauterive Hospital. At one time, they did not admit Blacks at all.	1:21
Kate Ellis	Yes.	1:34
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Someone told you about that?	1:35
Kate Ellis	No, no. I say yes. I didn't mean to say I understood. I just was sort of saying yes because I'm not surprised. So it was, what was it called, the hospital?	1:40
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Dauterive.	1:44
Kate Ellis	Can you spell that?	1:44
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	D-A-U-T-R-I-E-V-E. Dauterive Hospital.	1:48
Kate Ellis	Dauterive Hospital. And that was around here?	1:53
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah, right on Duperier. It's where the old convent is. You saw the convent school there?	1:56
Kate Ellis	I did.	2:03
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well, right there.	2:05
Kate Ellis	Okay.	2:05
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That used to be the old Dauterive Hospital.	2:07
Kate Ellis	And they only—	2:08
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	On this side where the gym area is, that's where the hospital, because the convent was always there.	2:09
Kate Ellis	Oh, okay.	2:17
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay. Where the gym area is, that was where Dauterive Hospital was. And at one time, they did not admit Blacks there.	2:17
Kate Ellis	So any Black person would go to Old Crawford?	2:26
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Crawford Hospital or to a clinic we had. What was the name? Tilley's Clinic.	2:29
Kate Ellis	Tilley's Clinic.	2:36
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Clinic. And Crawford Hospital. Crawford Hospital. Used to be the Old General Hospital. That's what it was.	2:39
Kate Ellis	Old General.	2:50
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That was Old General Hospital.	2:50
Kate Ellis	Was Tilley's Clinic just for Black people?	2:55
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	No, it was anyone.	2:57
Kate Ellis	That was also for Whites.	2:57
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah. They would serve Black there at Tilley's Clinic.	2:59
Kate Ellis	In a separate section?	3:02
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, yeah. All of them were separate.	3:05
Kate Ellis	Right.	3:06
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	The doctor's offices were all separate, waiting rooms and all were separate.	3:07
Kate Ellis	So as far as the doctor's offices being separate, do you mean that they were Black doctors and White doctors?	3:12
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	No, White doctors with separate waiting rooms for Blacks and Whites.	3:20
Kate Ellis	Okay.	3:30
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	They were all White.	3:33
Kate Ellis	They're all, okay.	3:33
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	All White. Now, we had a Black doctor here, but in 1944, they ran all the Black doctors out of city. Now, I know somebody's told you about that already.	3:33
Kate Ellis	I've heard about that. What do you remember of that?	3:39
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well, that was my first year of college.	3:42
Kate Ellis	And you were in Baton Rouge?	3:46
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I was in Baton Rouge, and I tell you, when that occurred, I wasn't here and studying my lesson and not reading the newspaper. I didn't know anything about it. And then, of course, it wasn't publicized on the radio. We used to listen to the radio, but I didn't hear. And then newspapers were not as prevalent and the news didn't travel as well then as it did.	3:48
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And of course, Whites running Blacks out of town, that wasn't news to be put — It was in the paper, but I didn't read that paper. There was a Black paper, the Pittsburgh Courier that we finally got and that's when I found out what was happening here. Because I can remember during that time, I came from summer school. No, the spring semester was over in May, and I came on the bus and I really walked from the bus station to here because I lived on this street. But on the other end of this same street, I've never moved.	4:12
Kate Ellis	Wow.	4:54
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And I didn't know that was going on. And when I got home, my mother asked me, she said, "How did you get here?" I said, "I walked." She said, "You don't know what's going on?" I said, "No." She said, "There's a curfew." I said, "There is? For what?" That's when she told me. That's when I really got nervous. I didn't even know anything about it, but nobody bothered me. I saw nobody was on the street, but people just didn't hang too much on the streets then.	4:55
Kate Ellis	When there was a curfew, what time did you get off the bus to walk home?	5:22
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	About nine something.	5:25
Kate Ellis	In the night?	5:26
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	In the night.	5:26
Kate Ellis	So an evening curfew.	5:28
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah, there was a curfew. Eight o'clock you had to be in. And I had just walked. A car passed, nobody told me anything. And I had my suitcase, because my trunk, I had chipped. And I was surprised when I got home and found out all about that situation, which I know you can get that out of the library because I know they have that.	5:29
Kate Ellis	But it made you nervous?	6:00
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, it did. Oh, when I got home and found out all that had gone on, my goodness, I was surprised and shocked. But of course, they were trying to organize NAACP during that time. That's what really caused the ruckus. Now, Southern University would've been here too a long time ago, but the Whites decided they didn't want it here because the Black children had to cut sugar cane and not go to school. So that's why Southerners, when they moved from New Orleans, was not brought here.	6:02
Kate Ellis	So they considered bringing it here?	6:34
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's right. They did.	6:36
Kate Ellis	And Whites wanted to keep their workers—	6:37
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Keep workers [indistinct 00:06:42] with cutting sugar cane. So they decided to put it in Scotlandville. And I never knew that until I went to Southern as a freshman and President Clark got up in chapel, giving the history of Southern. And when he said that, I could have died, because the kids who knew me, we were all together, said, "You mean to tell me you all cut sugar cane?" I said, "Well, I didn't." I said, "I worked in the houses." But we didn't cut sugar cane, but some other children did. I had relatives in my family the same age with me who worked out in the fields, but I didn't have to do that because we worked in the city here.	6:42
Kate Ellis	What was the response when you said that you worked, that they thought you might have worked in sugar cane?	7:34
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Sugar cane.	7:39
Kate Ellis	How did they perceive that job?	7:44
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	As a demeaning job.	7:45
Kate Ellis	Okay. You didn't want to say that you cut sugar cane?	7:47
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	No, well, I really didn't cut sugar cane, but then they said, "Cutting sugar cane, that's field work."	7:51
Kate Ellis	Right.	7:58
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	You see that's working in the field, a farmer. I said, "Well, no, I hadn't done that." But I have picked okra for my grandfather. I've picked pepper for my grandfather, but I didn't do it as a job, you see. I picked okra, but I love farming. I don't know. I guess, it's a part of my family history, and there's some type of innate, but I like working with the soil, flowers. I grow okra, peas, Lima beans, string beans, tomatoes, bell peppers, eggplants, squash, cucumbers. I had all that. Tomatoes, I've had all that in my garden. And of course, okra. But we've had so much rain there now, the things are playing out.	7:58
Kate Ellis	So more rain than usual?	8:54
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes. Last year I noticed a trend. We had more rain last year and again this year.	8:55
Kate Ellis	I wonder why.	9:01
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes. Now, what else you'd like me to dwell on?	9:03
Kate Ellis	Everything you're saying is really interesting. I'm just thinking, why is it that you and your family, you were able to work in homes instead of in the field?	9:08
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well, you see, my mother wanted an education for us. Now, my two older brothers didn't get the opportunity, but my sister, she had the opportunity. She would've been the first one to get a degree. Now, my oldest brother and my oldest sister and my older brother, we don't have the same mother. You see, their mother died and my dad remarried and he married my mother. And you see, they lived with my grandparents, the older two. But my sister lived with us, now, she would've been the first one to finish, but she decided she didn't want to go to college.	9:21
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	You see, now all of us went to college, all those. My sister has a degree, my youngest sister. My brother that's living has a degree in economics. But my brother that died, he went to more colleges than we did, but he never did finish, But he did go. That's the one that drowned. And my mother wanted us to have an education, so this is why she came to the city and worked real hard for us, to educate her children.	10:09
Kate Ellis	I see.	10:42
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's what she wanted. So we worked though, all of us, all but this younger sister, she didn't work out anyway.	10:43
Kate Ellis	Campbell?	10:51
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Ms. Campbell, she didn't work out anywhere.	10:52
Kate Ellis	Why?	10:53
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well, first she started school at an early age. She went to school when she was maybe about four. So she never did work out into the homes and things. She never did. And of course, then my mother was able, and my dad had started working. They had better jobs, and the opportunity got better. So she didn't have to, but all of us worked. Now, she went to school at the age of four, she went with Matthew Polk. He took her to school with her. She finished from Jeanerette.	10:54
Kate Ellis	Okay.	11:34
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well, she started here at IPTS. She went a while. Then she stopped. She went to Jeanerette, then she decided she'd moved to Houston. She even went to Jack [indistinct 00:11:47] in Houston with my uncle, my dad's brother. She stayed there a while. And then she came back and she graduated from Boley in Jeanerette, my sister, Elaine.	11:36
Kate Ellis	From?	11:57
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Boley High School.	11:57
Kate Ellis	Boley. Oh, B-O-L-E-Y.	11:58
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes. And that was a Black school named after a minister who worked at the school too.	12:00
Kate Ellis	And Mr. Matthew Polk was the principal—	12:07
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	At Boley High. Yes. She went there and then when she finished high school, she went to school in San Francisco.	12:09
Kate Ellis	Oh, wow.	12:16
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	She went to school in San Francisco, and then she decided to come home and she got her degree from Southern University.	12:17
Kate Ellis	She moved around.	12:31
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah. Oh yeah, she moved around quite a bit. Now, I finished high school from IPTS, third in the class. I got a scholarship to Southern University. Other than that, I don't guess I would have, but it's something about an individual who has a determination. I always knew I was going to be a teacher. Now, how I was going to reach that goal, I never knew. But this is what I tell the young students today, make up your mind what you want to do and there will always be a way, if you follow the right path, that you can succeed. And as I look back on my life, I just can't see how I had that perspective of going to school. My people did not have money. We did not have money. We just had work. And I had a scholarship to start, and then I had a work scholarship that kept me going as long as I stayed, and then I could get my degree.	12:32
Kate Ellis	So you've worked the entire time that you went through school?	13:33
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, yeah.	13:35
Kate Ellis	Sounds like from sixth grade.	13:36
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, yeah. Oh, yes. We worked. During that time, we all worked, but we weren't the type of children who spent their own money. We pooled it.	13:37
Kate Ellis	You did?	13:50
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	My mother.	13:50
Kate Ellis	And you gave so a lot to—	13:51
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Right. My parents, my mother, she was the one who got the money and bought whatever we needed to start school the next year and so forth. And that's what we did. And we'd have a little spending change, but we didn't spend money like kids today.	13:52
Kate Ellis	Right.	14:09
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's right. Whatever we made. Now, like my brothers worked at the pool hall, and then they'd rack the balls and things at the pool hall on Main Street, and then they would work caddy on the golf course.	14:10
Kate Ellis	So it sounds like, yeah.	14:26
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And we worked. They worked and everything they made, I guess, they kept a little something. And my mother would give us a little something to go to the store and we'd buy candy, to the movies. We'd go to the movie every Saturday and watch the cowboys.	14:28
Kate Ellis	Which movies did you, what movie theater did you go to?	14:45
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	We had Evangeline and the Palace theaters during that time.	14:47
Kate Ellis	Okay.	14:52
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I'm sure you must have that now.	14:52
Kate Ellis	I've heard of that. What do you mean?	14:54
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	The Palace Theater, I know someone has told you about those too.	14:56
Kate Ellis	Well, they haven't told us very much. I guess what I was trying to remember is which ones. Well, you tell me about them. They were segregated, right?	15:00
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, yes. We were in the balconies.	15:08
Kate Ellis	You were in the balconies.	15:10
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	In the balcony. We couldn't sit downstairs. We went upstairs. It was the balconies. And that's when we would go every Saturday, 5 cents. And sometime Ms. Little used to be a lady who would collect the money, and she would let us go up sometime if we had no money.	15:11
Kate Ellis	Is that right? That's nice.	15:30
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh yeah.	15:32
Kate Ellis	Wow.	15:32
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	There was some White people who were very nice.	15:33
Kate Ellis	Really? She was a White woman.	15:35
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah. Oh, of course. We didn't have Blacks working. Oh God. No. Because I can remember I had a bad experience one time with a bank teller.	15:37
Kate Ellis	What happened?	15:52
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I had a degree too, but he didn't know who I was. And I had gone in there to deposit some money. He didn't know who I was. And I went just at two o'clock when they locked the door. So he was kidding with me. So he said, I guess he was kidding, and he wasn't. He said, "h, we going to lock you up. I'm going to give you a mop and a bucket." And I was so mad, I didn't know what to do. I told him, "Oh no, you're not going to give me a mop and the bucket." I said, "Because if I had the opportunity, I'd take your job from you." That's what I told. And I was so mad. I went there several times and told him about the same thing.	15:53
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I went in there with my husband one time. Well, he knew my husband, you see, because my husband's dad had houses under rent. And my husband collected the rent, and he'd go turn the rent. Hi, Jake. I said, I used to curse. Well, I said, so and so who want to give me a mop and a bucket. And boy, he was really embarrassed when he found out who I really was, because he knew my husband. He said he didn't tell [indistinct 00:17:03]. So my husband told me, "Oh, that's the vice president of the bank." I said, "I don't give a who he is", because I was really mad. I said, "You just don't tell people this you don't know who they are because I could do just what he's doing there if they let me get back there." I was really mad, because I've run our federal credit union, and that's dealing with loans and money and transactions.	16:38
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Although I was a PE major, but I had accounting and stuff. And I've done further study in administration and supervision and stuff. So mad. Dealing with statistics now, I was a good statistic student, but I taught PE and I didn't want to move up and do nothing else. Reading all those papers and stuff, it's awful. They tried to get me to teach English once. I pitched a fit, said, "I'm not going to teach any English", my principal. And that was during the time they integrated the schools. And they looked at my transcript. See, because when I went to school with my electives and things, I didn't just take any [indistinct 00:18:13].	17:30
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I took English, History and Math. I took all that extra, well, I had had all the sciences, chemistry, biology, zoology, and anatomy. I had had all that in PE, you take all of that in PE. You see, you have to have that. In PE, I had had all of that. Well, they tried to get me to change my major, when I was a junior to Science, but I was a poor girl, and I didn't want to stay in school longer than I had to. I couldn't change my major. Then you got to upset the whole apple cart and go.	18:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Now, when I was a sophomore, physical therapy came out. I could have gone to New York City because there was a man that had come from some university, I don't remember then, and the coach had recommended me to go and take the course. Not a little country girl. And then that time too, that was around 1945, leave and go to New York.	18:49
Kate Ellis	You didn't like that?	19:24
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, I wasn't going. They tried. Everything would've been paid for, but then it would've taken me long and I didn't understand anything about physical therapy. That's when it had first come out. And Well, I didn't take that either. Then when I finished from Southern, I could have been teaching at Prairie View, but I was married then and I had a child, and I wouldn't take that job either because my husband had to be uprooted, I had a child. And teaching in a college, I needed money. I didn't have anything. So I wouldn't take that either. And I've done all right. It's been rough.	19:24
Kate Ellis	Has it?	20:05
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	It's been rough.	20:07
Kate Ellis	In what ways?	20:11
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well, money-wise. Teachers don't make any money. And yet I said that, it is awful because without teachers, you won't have anything else. And that's the people who should be paid. And you know what's happening? All the money is in administration. The supervisors of this, supervisors of that, those people are making the money. Where, down at the basic level, the people who are actually doing the work are not being paid for it. And I think that's an injustice. And I've always questioned that point.	20:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	There's a supervisor of this supervisor, supervisor of that supervisor. It's ridiculous. All the money's at the top. That's why the people, the poor people, will always be poor. Okay, they'll throw out a program, program, JPTC, okay, that program, they'll throw that out. By the time they get all the people to operate this program, they can't help the children who need it. And this is what happens. And that's where all the money is going. And that is ridiculous.	20:52
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Before they get anything done, they have to set it up. And the people who were working out the program was not going to help the people at all, they have spent the money. And by the time the money trickles to the people who actually need it, there's nothing left. And so you're not really helping anybody. Oh, it's awful. I sit and I listen to a lot of stuff and I say, it's pitiful. The people will always be poor. It's not going to be much help.	21:22
Kate Ellis	Can you tell me more about this neighborhood that you grew up in? What it was like when you were growing up?	21:58
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, it was wonderful. The older people had more control over the children. My mother could discipline, for instance, if you lived in this neighborhood, you, because your mother would not say anything, you see. I would walk down the street and if a neighbor saw me doing something that I shouldn't be doing, she could discipline me. But not anymore, people do not believe you telling them the truth about their children. And I'm not going to let you see me doing something and I know you going to let my mother know. Or you could even discipline me, even give me a whipping. And I wouldn't tell my mother not one word about it because I would get another one, you see.	22:03
Kate Ellis	Let's just keep it between us.	23:01
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I'd leave that alone. And not just that, you had to be respectful. Now, the older people, you would pass by them. You'd say, good afternoon or good morning, or what have you. You didn't pass by these older people. If you just didn't give them the time of the day, well, you're being disrespectful and this is what's happened, no morals. And these children can curse like, ooh, some of the curses I hear them with, it's unbelievable how they can rattle off this stuff. And it gets me mad too. I never did like this. Now, we couldn't call each other a liar when I came up in the house. We said that when you couldn't hear us. My mother and father never heard me say a curse word in the house when I was coming up. And I didn't do it when I was grown in their house either because they didn't allow this.	23:03
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And sisters and brothers stuck together. They stuck together and they had to go together, come back together. And we didn't go anywhere without a chaperone.	24:00
Kate Ellis	Really?	24:10
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And this neighborhood used to be well kept. It was a well kept area, but not anymore, these children. And it's all because the parents do not believe what other people tell them about their children. Now, you can't tell people about their children. And then something else, this child abuse stuff. These children can call the policeman on their parents. It shouldn't be allowed a good tanning is good for a kid to discipline them in the beginning. Now, then you could even talk. My mother just had to talk to us because when she would give us a whipping, we knew what it was for and we felt it.	24:11
Kate Ellis	And you never forgot it.	24:59
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, never forgot it. And we did everything we could not to get her mad. And that's the whole thing now, discipline. And it has to start at home. It has to. Now, just like integration. Integration is fine. And people think you want to integrate for intermarriage and all this, that's not necessary. The only integration that we were concerned with, if I have the money to go where you go, I'm allowed to go. I'll go with my own friends. I remember I was asked when we integrated the school, would I want my daughter to marry White? Well, no, I wouldn't want, because I think to each his own kind. Now you could be friendly and be friendly with someone. Because I have some very good friends, we'd go out and drink beer together and they White. But then I have my race and my friends also that I'm comfortable with, and I'm very comfortable with.	25:00
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	We go eat pizza and drink beer and stuff. Have a nice time. But it's not that we like — I'm really not for interracial marriage. But now, if it does occur, that's whom ever wants it.	26:12
Kate Ellis	But that's not something that you would recommend?	26:27
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	No, no. I don't recommend it that well, because I don't think, maybe in the future things may be different, but I doubt it. There will always be racism because there's a different kind of culture and all of this that when it's mixed, it's fine, but you with your kind. And I remembered when the schools were integrated. I was the Black working with three other Whites, and they used to accuse me of being more prejudice.	26:28
Kate Ellis	Really?	27:10
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	So I told them, well, I thought I had the right to be more prejudice because they had the better opportunity being White than I had being Black. So I told them, but I really wasn't prejudice. And then now I told them, everyone is prejudice, because actually you don't fool with all White people, do you?	27:10
Kate Ellis	I don't, I'm sorry.	27:32
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	You don't necessarily be with all White people?	27:34
Kate Ellis	No.	27:36
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	You see, there are certain, I hate to use classes, but that's what it really is.	27:37
Kate Ellis	Sure.	27:43
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	There are certain classes that you do not mix with, and that's the same. Blacks are like that too. Blacks have different type of friends that they deal with. It's according to your likes and dislikes. That's who you go with. And that's just the way life is, period. There are some people who are Black I don't have fool with them. I'll give them the time of the day, but they're not really my friends. And that's the way life is, it doesn't matter about color. It's the individual you like.	27:45
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	So one day I took them out in the yard and in the yard there were black birds and white birds. So I took them and I said, "What do you see?" They said, "Well, Miss G, we see black birds and white birds." I said, "Well, how are they?" I said, "Well, the black birds are together and the white birds are together." I said, "Yeah, you see that?" I say, "Each of his kind." I said, "Birds of a feather flock together."	28:19
Kate Ellis	And this was in your class?	28:47
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah. And this was in the class. I said, "Now, they're all in the same area, but they are not really mixed. One or two are straight over, but that's life. That's really the way life is." And I said, "And just look at them out there", I said, "And they're all in the same place, but they're with their kind." And that's human nature, that's the way it is. It's just a fact of life. And there will always be racism, and there will always be discrimination among races. You're not going to ever get rid of that, but it doesn't mean that you can't be kind with it. Now, that's what it is. And then of course, it's a rat race of jobs and so forth, just like affirmative action.	28:52
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I know a lot of people are not for it, but if it were not for it, we wouldn't have jobs at all being Black, because I don't care what you know, it's who you know that will get you a job. And that's life, it's not what you know, it's who you know. And you have to do so much to get a promotion and so forth and so on. And that was down then, it's a little better now, but it's not too much. It's not what you know, it's actually who you know in order to get a job.	29:47
Kate Ellis	So in this neighborhood, was it a predominantly Black neighborhood?	30:25
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Just three streets.	30:31
Kate Ellis	Just these?	30:32
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	This street. The next street predominantly Black, but now we have White neighbors now.	30:33
Kate Ellis	On this street?	30:40
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	But at one time, this street and the next street, predominantly Black.	30:43
Kate Ellis	So your friends that you grew up with, they were all Black?	30:49
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	They were all Black. Now, we knew White girls that were on the next couple of streets. Now, the street from the corner here, Black, but the street from the corner over there, White. Now, the next street too, Black, the other end, White. Now we knew all the White children.	30:51
Kate Ellis	You played together?	31:14
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah, yeah. We'd play together, but we went to separate schools and they could go to the Burger King and so forth. We couldn't until the integration. And they went downstairs to see the movies. We went upstairs. We couldn't go to their cafes to the front door. We could go buy what we needed at the back door. Now, the grocery stores, we could go in the grocery stores front.	31:16
Kate Ellis	You could?	31:46
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh yeah.	31:46
Kate Ellis	So you could shop in the same grocery stores. Cafes, you went in the back?	31:47
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	In the back, right.	31:51
Kate Ellis	And then—	31:52
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And some cafes.	31:55
Kate Ellis	Schools different, separate.	31:56
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	School was separate, yes.	31:57
Kate Ellis	And then your church.	31:58
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Church. Oh yeah. The church was — Now, the Catholic church at one time was for both, but the Blacks sat in the back and the Whites had the whole church where they sat, in the Catholic churches.	32:01
Kate Ellis	What did you think of that as you were coming up, going to these separate places and sitting in the balcony, going in the back, did you ever ask your parents why it had to be like that?	32:17
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well, you see, during our time, that's all we knew. We came up like that. We didn't—	32:29
Kate Ellis	Just the way it was was.	32:36
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah, we didn't like it, but we couldn't do anything about it. You see, and we went on. That's all. We wondered about it. Oh, we discussed it.	32:38
Kate Ellis	Did you?	32:50
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh yeah.	32:51
Kate Ellis	Among your friends?	32:51
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh yeah, around friends, fam, and students in the schools. Now, just in the schools, our books were discarded books from the White schools. Some pages were torn out, but we read everything we could put our hands on then. The Black students then were more interested in learning—	32:52
Kate Ellis	Really?	33:14
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Then. Because a lot of the students now, they have everything. They're not learning anything, Black and White. Most of them are not doing too well in school, period. A few are, but not that much. They're not reading enough. Now, we read everything, even though it was, we got everything, what I call, indirectly or secondhand, you see. Like experiments in high school, we didn't have experiments when I was in high school. We read them. Science experiments. We read, you see, about the experiments, but we didn't actually do no practical work at all. With one teacher, we had experiments, Mr. Henderson.	33:15
Kate Ellis	Oh yeah. Mr. JB.	34:04
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Mr. J.B. He was my eighth grade science teacher. And I'll never forget this, because he did the process of osmosis. And it was so interesting to us, we never forgot it. How you transfer a liquid from a lower level to higher level and stuff like that. And that was the only experiments that we had during that time. And he had done it by some improvisation, I've forgotten exactly how it was, but I'll never forget that. And then he did it with a siphon. And then we came home and my cousin's father was doing it, but he didn't know what he was doing.	34:04
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And we used to talk about science so much when we were young. And we'd come talk about science. And he used to say, science, science. And they didn't believe too much in science because science, they felt, contradicted the Bible with creation. And they didn't care too much for science, the older people. Older Black people, they didn't understand. Half of them didn't read either. So we came one day and he was doing this, and we told him what it was. He said, "Oh." We said, "Yeah. Well, we learned it in the book." But he didn't know the process he was doing, but we knew what the process was. And we told him. And he was amazed.	34:51
Kate Ellis	Really.	35:32
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And then they started kind of listening to us a little bit.	35:33
Kate Ellis	The older people did.	35:37
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Not too much.	35:38
Kate Ellis	When you could explain what they were doing.	35:39
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	We could explain what they were doing. And they were actually doing this.	35:42
Kate Ellis	Now, what was he doing that he was actually doing this?	35:44
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	He was taking, suctioning gas out of the tank of a car and had it, see the tank is up this high and he had a tube in there. And he did the suction process with his mouth and then he let the gas fall in the jar.	35:47
Kate Ellis	Interesting.	36:07
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And he didn't know what he was doing. And we had had it in the science grade and we were tickled pink.	36:10
Kate Ellis	I bet you were.	36:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	I never did forget them, some experiences. And those are some experiences that we've had with our parents. Now, my dad couldn't read at all. He went to school, but he didn't learn because he was too busy doing other things, cutting, working, and so forth and so on.	36:14
Kate Ellis	Cutting cane?	36:38
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Cutting cane. Yeah.	36:39
Kate Ellis	When he came up, he—	36:41
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh yeah, my daddy and his father was a farmer. he came up in Louisville. And that's where they went to school.	36:41
Kate Ellis	Now, his father was a farmer. Does that mean he was a sharecropper?	36:47
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah. Sharecropper. Now they had that own farm, but they couldn't read. And they lost the farm by buying grocery on credit.	36:50
Kate Ellis	From Whites?	37:05
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	From Whites. And they claimed they didn't pay them. And they would make their crops and they didn't get the right money. They couldn't meet their payments. So they took the farm from them.	37:06
Kate Ellis	Oh.	37:17
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	They had a lot of property, my dad's people. But not my mother's people, my mother's daddy could read. And she had really no formal education, my mother, but my mother went to public school in the daytime with the children because she wanted to learn to read.	37:17
Kate Ellis	Like you when you were going to school, she went too.	37:36
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well, after I finished high school, my mother went back to school and day she got her ninth grade certificate.	37:40
Kate Ellis	Wow. So that she could learn to read.	37:46
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	She could learn to read. That's right.	37:50
Kate Ellis	Now, somebody else had told me that, and I don't know why it surprised me, but it probably shouldn't have surprised me. But I think he was talking about how his, Whites didn't want Blacks to even be able to count.	37:53
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	No.	38:07
Kate Ellis	Because, that, again—	38:07
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Because that, again, would keep them from progressing.	38:07
Kate Ellis	So your father's father who lost the land—	38:14
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Lost the land. Yeah.	38:18
Kate Ellis	He probably—	38:18
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's right, because they couldn't read and they couldn't figure, you see? And they didn't know how much they were getting or anything. But now my mother's dad, when he came, my mother's dad came from Virginia, at least my dad dad, all of them came from Virginia. All of us.	38:20
Kate Ellis	Wait, your father's?	38:39
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah, my grandfather. Both of my grandfathers come from Virginia, the state of Virginia, and from Richmond. That's where they came from. Now my mother's dad could read, because when he came here, he was 12 and he could read.	38:41
Kate Ellis	He had been taught to read in Virginia?	38:58
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes, in Virginia. And they bought land now. We still have the land in St. Martin Parish.	38:59
Kate Ellis	Really?	39:05
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	My grandfather's. Oh yeah. My grandfather's on my mother's side. We have 40 some acres of land in—	39:05
Kate Ellis	What are you doing with it?	39:12
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	They're farming it.	39:13
Kate Ellis	Farming.	39:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	They're farming it.	39:13
Kate Ellis	Who's farming it?	39:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	My mother's nephews.	39:13
Kate Ellis	Wow.	39:14
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah. We still have it, we've inherited it because my grandfather's dead. He lived to 94, too, my mother's daddy. And now we still have that land, but my grandfather and them knew how to read.	39:14
Kate Ellis	He learned that in Richmond?	39:31
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	He learned that in Virginia. They came from Virginia. He was 12 and he could read. And they were able to save their land and farm their own land and made their own money.	39:33
Kate Ellis	And that's where your mother came from?	39:46
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's where my mother came from.	39:47
Kate Ellis	But you're saying that she still wanted to come into the city.	39:48
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes.	39:50
Kate Ellis	Because she wanted you all to get an education.	39:51
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	In school.	39:54
Kate Ellis	What did she tell you about getting an education?	39:55
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Because I'd live a better life. And you see, during that time, school teaching was the best thing for Black people, period.	40:00
Kate Ellis	That was the top?	40:07
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That was the job. And so that's what we all were, school teachers.	40:09
Kate Ellis	Really?	40:13
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Most of the folks are school teachers. Now, we've had principals, supervisors, counselors. Now, my son majored in accounting. My daughter majored in marketing. Well, she's in Atlanta. She doesn't live here. And my son is a head of our federal credit union here now. And he did work for the SBA at one time until the grant ran out. And he did work with the oil field. But then, of course, he was an accountant, but he had to start at the bottom and he was driving a truck and he didn't like that and so he stopped. And now you see, even in the banks, banks now, we have men who can't go any higher, like being vice president even though they have degrees in accounting, they can have degrees in I don't know what. But now women are advanced, Black women.	40:16
Kate Ellis	But not Black men?	41:21
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Not Black men.	41:21
Kate Ellis	Why is that, do you think?	41:23
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well, because a Black man, that makes a difference with Whites.	41:23
Kate Ellis	That sounds like your machine.	41:29
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's—	41:29
Kate Ellis	About why Black men—	41:29
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And of course, that's kind of nationwide too. It's okay for a Black to move up in the banks and they move up like loan officers and everything., But they do not get the pay. It's just a name thing. I'm sorry, but it's just the name thing. Because I can remember, we had a teacher whose son had moved up in the bank. And of course, he was a business major and he had a degree in social studies too. He was teaching school. So he got this job in the bank and he thought he was going to, and he had a big fancy name and everything. And my friend told me, he said, "Nah, it's just a name on it because he not making any money that I'm making teaching school." So there you go. They can't get to be vice president of the banks or anything here. That hasn't happened yet. So there's still a lot of—	41:40
Kate Ellis	Jim Crow.	42:45
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Jim Crow. Right. That's your paper. I don't want you to lose, because I have one night that I haven't read my paper today.	42:46
Kate Ellis	Okay, well I'll take it with me when I go.	42:52
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yeah. Don't forget it. That's why I put it there.	42:54
Kate Ellis	One second. There was something I wanted to just ask you a couple more things. Well, I have a general question. Are there other things that stand out for you as far as life during Jim Crow, segregation?	42:58
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes. In the segregated area, Blacks are not really recognized for their worth. You have to be doubly qualified. And even if you are qualified, you have to go along with what I call, the program. If you disagree with what's going on, you are never pulled in on operational things like in the city. They're not going to call you at all, they'll call somebody else who will go along with what they want done. Like elected officials and stuff like that, you'll never get anywhere with them, not if you have your own opinion.	43:25
Kate Ellis	Did that happen to you?	44:23
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well, actually I've never tried because I don't think I can, I can't be the type of person to just go along with a person. And I know that's not the right thing for me. So I have never actually tried to get into a position. For instance, I've qualified for administration and supervision since the 1970s. And I never applied for any position in that capacity because I didn't think I would be able to function like I would want to function.	44:25
Kate Ellis	If I can say this within a White structure, basically?	45:06
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's right. Because I can't just go along with anything. And I wouldn't be able to work in a position where it's demeaning to me. I'd have to go along with what I thought was the right thing to do.	45:08
Kate Ellis	You envisioned trouble in a sense if you did work among those people.	45:29
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And now a lot of people in our area, they prefer, because I notice a lot of them want people in the positions who not really able to function in the capacity, yet those are the people they will select.	45:38
Kate Ellis	As if there would be puppets in a sense?	45:59
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	In a sense, that's what it's all about. And when our people get up there, they're not able to do anything for the majority of Black people. They can't do that because they're under obligations to others to just do mediocre things, that's the way I look at it. Everything's political, that's what, and I'm not a political person. I don't like politics. I vote my conviction.	46:02

Kate Ellis	You like to question everything.	0:01
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	If you say, do it this way, I want to know why we can't do it another way. Because I've learned that during integration, whatever a Black person says it's going to be right on the money, but a White person is going to take it and change the language of the meaning. I said, "No, that's not what I," and that's why I'm controversial. And I had that problem with some professors—	0:06
Kate Ellis	Really?	0:46
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	— in school.	0:46
Kate Ellis	White professors?	0:47
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	White professors. And nobody would know an answer. And you would come up with the right answer and they would say, "Well, yes, but let's say it this way." And I've had professors to question me. Want to know what I do, and if I've had piano lesson, do I go fishing? I like flowers and things. I said, "Yes, I do all those things. Piano lesson, everything." "We knew there was something different about you." I'm not different. There are many Blacks like me. We are not that different. We like nice things. We like cultural music. I can listen to any kind of music. We came up on country and western music.	0:48
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Now you see my daughter in Atlanta, she keeps her, now she didn't come up with me.	1:45
Kate Ellis	She didn't?	1:52
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Not during my time. She got a certain country and western station she puts on when she's riding in her car. She likes it. I mean, you derive, you get a desire for certain things, certain songs, certain techniques that you like. And you don't have to be of a particular color to like Picasso's stuff. It doesn't take color, just takes the individual. And that's what people don't understand that because you're Black, you are not supposed to. And they're afraid. A lot of Whites are afraid of Black because they're Black, but they don't know them. Now if you are attractive or a lighter color or a lighter hue than they have of a different attitude towards you. And this is really true.	1:52
Kate Ellis	So you think that Whites treat lighter skinned Blacks—	2:52
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh yes.	2:56
Kate Ellis	What kind of differences have you seen?	2:58
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh I've seen it because I've had people tell me, "They don't really have a place." This is what it is. They're not, they're too light to be Black and they know they can't actually accept them because they are not White. But then they feel sorry because they're in between and they have no set place. Now Blacks, Blacks have a place, black Blacks, they know where they should be. But then the lighter ones, then they're just misplaced. They have no place.	3:00
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	For instance, this case in Mississippi. I know you've heard an interracial young lady and this prom situation. I know you know about that. Well, he said she was a mistake because she doesn't fit any place. She's actually, and now they're trying to have the race biracial instead of a Black or White or other, you see? Because other, you are a Japanese, Chinese or whatever, you see? But then if you of a mixed race, a Black and a White, then they're trying to get this biracial in there rather than being Black because actually the person is not really a Black person and she's not actually a White person. Now where do I fit? So we don't know where it's going to hold in.	3:42
Kate Ellis	Well, it sounds like that community, Grand, Grand Marais.	4:35
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Yes. Oh yes. Now that's a thriving community. Now a lot of them marry Whites, period. And live in the area.	4:39
Kate Ellis	Well, when you were coming up, were there?	4:52
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh no, they didn't mix with black Blacks.	4:54
Kate Ellis	When you were coming they stayed—	4:57
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, no, no, no, no. They had what is known as, they had a Bruce Arts Foam. They had that special amusement place. People of my color could not go there. Now I can remember the owner of Bruce Arts Foam, I taught the daughter. she got married and then they moved to Baton Rouge. She insisted that I go to the wedding. I didn't want to go.	4:58
Kate Ellis	— Really?	5:25
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Because I know I didn't want to go because if I know that's how people are, I can stay away from there. I don't have to mix. That's the way I feel about it.	5:25
Kate Ellis	Why would I want to go someplace around—	5:36
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	But when she came home to get married, she called me and she said, "I want you at my wedding." I was a homeroom teacher for four years and I really didn't know what to do. So I told her, I said, "Well, yes, I will go to the wedding." Well, she married at St. Edwards Catholic Church. I figured I'd go to the church. Now I'm walking out of the church and there's the car. And I waited a long time thinking she would've gone on after the wedding. She put the window down and called me. "I want you to come to the reception." Holy cow. And in St. Edwards Church, there were three people of color. And I was one.	5:38
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	And I had a cousin. My husband had a cousin from Galveston who was here at the time. Well, I took her with me because she was light.	6:30
Kate Ellis	— Because she was light.	6:39
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	She was light colored.	6:39
Kate Ellis	So was she—	6:39
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	So we went to the church together. I felt pretty good because I was with her. So they figured, "Well, this Black one is with one of us. So I guess it's okay." So when I get out of church, she wants me to come to the farm. I said, "The heck with it, we're going to the farm." So we went on to the farm and they were, well, a lot of the kids I taught, well, they were coming up to me and everything. So one of the girls say, "Come on, Kathy wants you to come on in inside the house." Go inside the house, she grabs me and kiss me. And they were really lighting. They were all turning beat red because she had kissed me. I'm so dark. Said, "Lord, if I just could get away from here."	6:43
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	So my cousin Ala May, I'll never forget her, we were in there and so I congratulate her and everything. And I knew her parents already and I got the hell on out of there. And she says, "You can't leave now. You have to go into the barn." And they had a big bond. They had a music box, table, chairs and everything because they had their own entertainment.	7:27
Kate Ellis	Oh, 'cause it was just this—	7:54
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Riley was a select group, the entertainment they had. The music box and tables, chairs and everything. A dance floor and everything. It was called Broussard's Farm from a lot people. Now you could go there with somebody else, but if they knew you, you could stay, maybe. It all depends. But any other Blacks uninvited—	7:54
Kate Ellis	No.	8:18
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	— you couldn't go there. So we went on in there, I said, "Ala May, we going to get," and they were serving box lunches. And so the children came, "Oh, Miss [indistinct 00:08:28], you got to get your dinner." I said, "Well look, you go get me a plate. And I'm getting out. I must go because I have another engagement." Girl, I was so glad to get away from there because if you not wanted, I don't care about going where I'm not wanted because I have other places I can go where I am wanted. And so that, yes, that's the way it used to be. And very few of them would—	8:19
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Now a lot of them who were able, they went to Holy Rosary, which was Catholic, a Catholic school. Now those, and after St. Edwards stopped, it was too costly for them to continue the high school, St. Edwards. So they discontinued the high school. St. Edwards had a high school. Well most of the Malayas would go there because the sisters were White and they taught, but they wouldn't go to the public school because they were mixed up too much with Blacks.	8:54
Kate Ellis	And the people—	9:24
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Regular Blacks.	9:24
Kate Ellis	— the Malayas wanted to stay away from—	9:25
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	You couldn't marry a Malayas. Now they're intermarrying a little bit it's just like we.	9:27
Kate Ellis	— Now when was this period, the time of the wedding? Around what year was that? I mean, you don't have to remember the exact year of it.	9:33
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh, that was around 1950.	9:40
Kate Ellis	So 1950.	9:42
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Around '56, '57 in that area. Oh yeah. And a lot of them are still like that. Oh, they're still like that.	9:44
Kate Ellis	There's a lot of that—	9:54
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Oh there's a lot of that. A lot of them, now I know a family, you can mix, but you can't marry dark. All that's today.	9:55
Kate Ellis	— So you can spend time—	10:08
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	With them.	10:09
Kate Ellis	— with them, you can have friends who are darker.	10:10
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Friends, but they don't want you to marry, inter marry when it's too dark.	10:12
Kate Ellis	That would darken—	10:15
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Darken their skin. Oh yes. And you don't want it. I got a niece she just left from here. She almost light as you.	10:16
Kate Ellis	— Really?	10:27
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	That's my sister's child. Wait till you see my sister, we of mixed color. I have a brother who is very light. I have a sister who's very light. Now the darker ones. I'm the darkest. I have a brother that was a little darker than me and I got another brother who is the same color. But I got some real fair, we're mixed. My daddy was very fair.	10:27
Kate Ellis	So who do you think in his family was White? I'm assuming that somewhere—	10:56
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	My daddy's grandfather was a White man.	11:03
Kate Ellis	— Was White, okay.	11:04
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Well look, my husband, step up here. Look at that. Look, you see the picture? There's a man picture and there's a big one up above it. Right there.	11:06
Kate Ellis	Do you want me to take that off for a second—	11:16
Melvenia Lelia Polk Durall	Okay.	11:16
Kate Ellis	— and then you can show me your pictures?	11:18

Item Info

Title:

Melvenia Durall interview recording, 1994 July 22

Date:

July 22, 1994

Creator:

Durall, Melvenia Lelia

Contributor:

Ellis, Kate

Description:

Name: Melvenia Lelia Durall; Date of birth: 1924-12-01; Place of birth: Loreauville, LA; Occupation(s): educator; Residence: New Iberia, LA
Informant ID: 618; Interviewed by: Kate Ellis.

Occupation:

Educator

Location:

Format:

Language:

English

Digital Collection:

Behind the Veil

Source Collection:

Behind the Veil: Documenting African American Life in the Jim Crow South interviews, photographs, and project records, circa 1864-2011, bulk 1990-2004

Series:

Related Resources:

See below

Provenance:

The David M. Rubenstein Rare Book and Manuscript Library acquired the Records of the Behind the Veil Oral History Project from the Duke University Center for Documentary Studies in 1997, 1998, 2000, and 2002.

Rights:

Limited Re-Use

CC BY-NC 4.0

Rights Note:

Copyright for content created by the Behind the Veil project is held by Duke University and made available to the public using a Creative Commons Attribution / Non-commercial (CC-BY-NC) license.

Identifier:

RL00170-CS-1080
RL00170-CS-1081
ba96b41f-d41e-463d-bdff-dcd293c7ad70
behindtheveil
07bb6c86-8dd5-4504-9b07-48e3bf2507ac
ark:/87924/r4rj4n40k
07bb6c86-8dd5-4504-9b07-48e3bf2507ac

Permalink:

https://idn.duke.edu/ark:/87924/r4rj4n40k

Sponsor:

Sponsor this Digital Collection

Melvenia Durall interview recording, 1994 July 22

Transcript

Item Info

1. Melvenia Durall administrative file, 1994

John Hope Franklin Research Center

More Info & Options

Melvenia Durall interview recording, 1994 July 22

Transcript

Item Info

Related Items

John Hope Franklin Research Center

More Info & Options