Charles Pollard: The end of the Colored people's line is right back there. Stacey Scales: In this field? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Slow down [indistinct 00:00:10]. So all this is old John's place, 420 acres, each side. Railroad and— Stacey Scales: I want to put this microphone on you because— Charles Pollard: Yeah. The railroad over there, and he got 420 acres in here. He promised to—I could work it as long as he didn't sell it for $400, but I made so much cotton on there, he took it from me. Stacey Scales: Who took it from you? Charles Pollard: White man. Stacey Scales: What? Charles Pollard: Because it belonged to White. All this belonged to White. I used to work all of it. I had six acres. I picked 13 bales off it, before I stopped picking. Now this here, this belongs to somebody else now. That's the block school. That was school for Notasulga. Stacey Scales: Oh, yeah? What about this lake over here? Charles Pollard: Well it belonged to Whites, and they were burning it off. Burning it off over there now, cleaning it off. Part of it is, we used to work all this land in here, back 50 years ago. We worked clear on up here to this bridge. But White folks owned that from back down there, on this side of the church. White folks owned that. Yeah. You all went all in there. That's the propane and mill yard out there. Colored fellow bought it and selling it. He bought that place. And that's been there for—That's the end of that now. Now we're in the city limits. Stacey Scales: So the bridge ends the line? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Stacey Scales: Okay. Charles Pollard: Yeah. See, we're in the city limits now. From right there at that store. There's a little store back there. This is the overhead bridge. This been here. We used to didn't have a bridge here to cross the railroads back in the '30s. We crossed on the railroads. Stacey Scales: Oh, yeah? Charles Pollard: Yeah. We had to stop for the train. Want to go through North Salem? Stacey Scales: Oh, you want to go and look through the town? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Stacey Scales: Okay. Charles Pollard: Yeah. Stacey Scales: Sorry. Charles Pollard: Yeah. I thought—And I'll keep check on it. Yeah, we're going—You ain't got to go so fast. They ain't behind you. All of these White in here. Ain't no Colored people. Well it is, one or two. Well, we've got some Coloreds up in here now, but the older heads died out, and you know White people, they don't like a gang of children. They don't have a gang of children. Some of them don't want any. But you see, the older heads gone. There's a Colored fellow stay right there. Charles Pollard: And that was one of Paul Ray's old house. Him and his wife stay there. These houses are empty— Stacey Scales: How long has this been White? Charles Pollard: It seems to been all my life. Stacey Scales: Really? Charles Pollard: Yeah. When I was a little boy, I came to notice that. When cheese was a nickel a pound, you'd get more than you could eat then. Now, you can get about $5 worth, and you don't have enough to eat. That's strange, ain't it? Stacey Scales: Mm-hmm. Charles Pollard: See, when it was a nickel a pound, Prince Albert, 10 cents, [indistinct 00:03:26] nickel bond, that—I never did smoke. I never did smoke. I never did drink no whiskey. I used to bootleg some whiskey. Bootleg, but you got sealed whiskey everywhere. Charles Pollard: I used to live right back there, me and my wife, when I married her. That was a little store there. All this White in here. Used to farm cotton right out there. Stacey Scales: You did? Charles Pollard: No. Stacey Scales: Okay. Charles Pollard: Other people. Stacey Scales: Do you know- Charles Pollard: Just hold to the—Gone around to the right of the light. Stacey Scales: Okay. Charles Pollard: To the right of the light. Stacey Scales: Okay. Charles Pollard: Yeah, don't go so fast, so we can look while we're looking. Well you've got the [indistinct 00:04:08] now, I see. That's the wash house. That's the bank right over there. We used to have two banks. That's a—It was a shirt factory, but they moved it from there and got something else. Now that used to be a post office over there, but it's something now. Just ride on across the bridge here, to the old school where integration took place. Stacey Scales: Did this area here have a place where Black folks would shop? Like Black- Charles Pollard: Oh, yeah. Stacey Scales: —owned places. Charles Pollard: Oh, no. They didn't have no stores they owned. Some of them had a little rusty ranch around, an eating place, but all the stores, White folks owned all the stores. That's the old cemetery out there. Some out there were buried in the 1600s. Charles Pollard: Yeah, that old fellow stay there, Edward Brown. That's the White folks cemetery. This is all White folks in here. That's the old Hottington house. I don't think nobody—All of them are dead and gone. I don't think nobody even live in the house. This house here, old fellow Bentley stay in this house here. Now he's the grass man. Down there below my house, all that grass from down there by the big bridge? Stacey Scales: Yeah. Charles Pollard: Well that's his farm. Bentley. He stays right back there. He got some boys running it for him. One of his sons runs it. Stacey Scales: Okay. Charles Pollard: This is the high school here. We might—Drive around it, if you want to. Yeah, that's where we go to—That's where the integration come up, and police led them through up here and they—One of them, when they came through, got over here and unloaded. One of the White fellows here in Tuskegee kicked the driver. All of them were White, you know? Stacey Scales: Mm-hmm. Charles Pollard: But he kicked it. Now go in a little square, that way. The teachers and them, they had classes in all those trailers, and that's the school. That brick part been there. My wife played football and basketball down there. I would have been—play basketball in one of these buildings here. That's the football field down there. Stacey Scales: So what year did that take place? Do you remember when that took place? Charles Pollard: When the integration came on. Stacey Scales: Okay, '60s? Charles Pollard: And they been had Coloreds every since. That was when, in '63? I think it was '63. This a new building over here they built then. Charles Pollard: We'll ride out this way, just a little piece. Right off to the right. That used to be the old Tom Livingston place. Judge Livingston. Stacey Scales: And that's who? Charles Pollard: Gunner's old house back there, of course he's dead and gone. And that was the old judge's place. We can go out [indistinct 00:07:43]. This one of the gunnery houses here. One of them stay there. And the little fellow that runs that, he went to Auburn, but Butch came back down here. They own that land in here, and I know when he bought it. Been cutting hay all day. That's where they run the hardware, called Butch knife. But what—And that's the other brother's place there. He works around Auburn, I think. But they own all that land down there, for hay grass. Most of them places pasture grass now. Some coming over to my house. I got a field of hay they're going to cut. Get me a little money out it. I done raised—I used to have 150 heifers. Stacey Scales: 150 what? Charles Pollard: Cows. 150 head of cattle. They done started to cutting that. Look like it's been cut in the last day. Well I probably—I'm supposed to start on mine next week. Stacey Scales: Did you have White neighbors when you stayed here? Charles Pollard: Oh, yeah. Yeah, they were White and Coloreds all around in here. And on back there was an old White man. He had a whole lot of White children my color. Two sisters had children by one White man, way back. Stacey Scales: Really? Charles Pollard: Way back, long when I was born. Of course they—One of them is still in Florida. Let's turn around up here on the top of this hill. Stacey Scales: Okay. Charles Pollard: That's where one of my neighbors live, there. John. That's where one of our deacons live, right here. We'll pull up in here in John—Pull around and turn around here, top of this hill. Gone out there further. Don't go so fast to make a turn right in here. We can see it pretty good. Stacey Scales: Cool. Charles Pollard: Don't get on the grass. Go to the road, this clay. Ms. Poet stays there. Her husband died. James Willie stays out there. He worked with that man on the grass mower. Roy Gridhouse stays out there, one of our deacons. He got a son live right there. They own those houses. John, me and him go out to the site together, he stays in that house. That's the old Apple Grove schoolhouse. The old church used to be in there, we called Apple Grove. Stacey Scales: Apple Row? Charles Pollard: Apple. Stacey Scales: Apple. Okay. Charles Pollard: Oak Grove. Way back years ago. It ain't nothing there now. Everything done rotten down. You've only got one, take it easy here now. This road here, this is the main one. I thought that was him. It is. He is out there cutting. Yeah. Stacey Scales: What did you do? Charles Pollard: Nobody. I don't have no machines. See I was going to cut mine, unless I give it to him and tell him to cut it. He has some cattle, one of my neighbors. Told him to give me something if he wanted. He didn't take it. He drove that far out there. Yeah, they're cutting that hay today. That's old Butch out there. Watch for these cars now, coming out here. You don't want to hit none of them. Yeah. Charles Pollard: And that's the high school. Mike, my grandson there at the trailer, he went to school there right—Way back in the '60s. Stacey Scales: Okay. Charles Pollard: And they're all mixed up now. That's when the integration started. That's the old Judge Livingston house. Stacey Scales: He's a judge in Notasulga? Charles Pollard: Well that's back 50 years ago. Then they got a mayor up here. He runs the whiskey store and runs the store. It ain't but one store up here now. Stacey Scales: Really? Charles Pollard: One grocery store, and he runs—His wife and son runs it. We'll go by there, but he runs the whiskey store up the road. That's the old White people's cemetery. That's the old rental loft, where my wife—She used to work for them folks right there. Stacey Scales: Where did attorney Gray live back then? Charles Pollard: Who? Stacey Scales: Gray. Charles Pollard: He lived in Tuskegee. Stacey Scales: Right. Charles Pollard: Yeah. Stacey Scales: Did he near you? Charles Pollard: Take it easy now. Let's go down this way. Kind of stop and go down this way. Be sure you're clear. Charles Pollard: That was the old Hope house. The back of it, but he's gone. And he lived to 102. He died. That's the old depot man. He used to have a depot here, a train stop. Don't nothing stop here now. Tullis is that way, Auburn straight up, 13 miles. We're going up towards the county line and turn around. We're in Macon County, but when we get up here and where we'll turn around, we'll be in Lee County. Charles Pollard: That's the fellow work on cars, there. Trucks, everything. This what you call the town brain. Used to baptize in there. You know, it don't rain like it used to be. Stacey Scales: They used to baptize where? Charles Pollard: Don't go so fast. Right there. But you see grass done grew up in there now. Stacey Scales: Do you know anybody that got baptized in there? Charles Pollard: Yeah, I knew plenty of them baptized there. This was my wife's church. We stayed together 54 years. Now there were some houses bought and put up there, some double wide trailers. This Macedonia here. That was my wife's church. She died in '89. These are all Coloreds over here on this side. They bought those places and built those houses here, just a few years ago. These been over here a little while. Yeah, they've been there. That boy work at the VA Hospital. They've been there a long time. Charles Pollard: And some of my friends stay there, over here. I don't think nobody—That boy died in there. The boy didn't have much judgment. He went to—Bennington sent him to the penitentiary. Stacey Scales: What's the name of the place where they were baptizing people again? Charles Pollard: Macedonia there, that church we had passed. Stacey Scales: And then people from that church were baptized down in that water? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Back years ago. They ain't had no baptizing this year, I don't think. Told you here. Put your lights on. We wanted to turn here. Stacey Scales: Turn left? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Don't go so fast. Pull up in there. Stacey Scales: You want to go down there and come back up? Charles Pollard: Just turn around. We're at the line now. Charles Pollard: Someone's on a motorcycle. We used to go up to Opelika, because they had one of them. You could take your whole family on it, and a trailer behind it, and a rig look like a motorcycle. And had the trailer behind, carry his whole family on it. It was $17,000. That boy work at the VA Hospital, there. Yeah, that was Lee County we turned around in. All of this is Macon County. That girl that cooks for me, that's her mother's house. That's their house right back there to the right. Stacey Scales: What was the biggest crop in this area? Charles Pollard: Well ain't no crops now. It done- Stacey Scales: No, you said, "50 years ago." Charles Pollard: Oh, yeah. We used to farm cotton and corn. Stacey Scales: Cotton and corn were the biggest? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Peanuts. We raised a few peanuts one year, but cotton and corn were the main thing. Raised a lot of sugarcane. I used to make syrup. I made syrup from it. Stacey Scales: How did people feel when Carver said to grow peanuts? Charles Pollard: They—All right. Those that had their own land, they raised them. And the other ones raised them for the White folks. Didn't many Coloreds—We're going to cut to the right here now. To the right. See, we came from that way, we're going back here. This the old depot place. That's the gas place there. That's the FHA Co-Op Farm. Co-Op done bought everything in there. That's where I used to buy a lot of fertilizer from. Charles Pollard: We're going on out here where I eat damn near every day. There's Colored people there, and Colored people, they own this here. This is some of my people here, the Grimmetts. The Grimmetts stayed there. Stacey Scales: Oh, yeah? Charles Pollard: Yeah. White right there. That's where Grimes stayed at. Used to run the filling station down there, next to the inn, but he stays down there. He stopped running it and bought that place there. Stacey Scales: The Grimmetts, that's your mother's side, right? Charles Pollard: Yeah, on my mother's side, the Grimmetts. These are all White in here. Old. Done got old, most of them. And the young ones, gone. Some of them—That may be empty there. Well he died, but I reckon why—I think the fellows that built them over, they done sold them. They couldn't keep them. Yeah, White on both sides. Charles Pollard: That's the road. We come right through there now, when we're going to get something to eat, we'll go back through there. That's where my nephew stays, there. One of my old friends, White lady, stays over here. Stacey Scales: You know every house. Charles Pollard: Yeah. I got a grape pauper there. We eat the grapes. Stacey Scales: What used to be right here? Charles Pollard: That's just an old pasture over there. They started that store back there, 50 years ago, but you know the—I don't know why that fellow died, what started it, I think. All of them are Whites right here now. A little old store there. Charles Pollard: We used to work that land all out there, where that hay bale is up there. They done baled that hay out. Looks like they just baled it. I stop at that store here, about every day. Charles Pollard: Oh, she's cutting her grass. They got a pretty—Some cattle in there off over here. We're going to turn up here at this post to the left. That's where we eat, out there. Stacey Scales: Right here? Charles Pollard: Yeah. You're going to go down in there and turn around. Straight on down in there. Stacey Scales: So you come out here to eat every day? Charles Pollard: Yeah. And put them—And back. Right back. [indistinct 00:21:44] in there. Now bag back. Straight back. Down a little. Don't hit the fence now. Because the fence belong to somebody else. Somebody hit it up there on the corner now. They've been hitting it. Yeah, we hit down there every day. That's Bubba Langford. He's the mayor. He built that for the senior citizens. He gets paid from the government I reckon, for that. Imagine he does. Behind the covered building. Old pole cat, I believe. You can smell those skunks, ain't you? Skunks, we call them pole cats. Stacey Scales: Pole cats? Charles Pollard: Yeah. That's the old cemetery. That's the old cemetery there. They bury one out there every once in a while. And then they got a new one right there, next to the slight, on the South side of that place where we eat. Where them—They got some pretty houses out there. That's what I used to raise at. I had some red Angus. I got them from out in Wisconsin. They came from out there. Charles Pollard: Yeah, we used to work all that land out there. Those guys, they're cutting that hay, ain't they? Stacey Scales: Mm-hmm. Charles Pollard: I believe they are packing it and baling it now. We'll cut through right there, where that car came out from. Stacey Scales: Okay. Charles Pollard: Yeah, my niece stay—One of my cousins stays there, Nadine. Her husband died 10 or 12 ago. They lived in Chicago but they came back home and bought that place there. He died. Tywanna Whorley: You have missed seven calls. Charles Pollard: Huh? Stacey Scales: Somebody called you. Tywanna Whorley: Seven calls. Charles Pollard: And we had some corn groves in there. Old fellow stay right back there. When he come out to eat crumpets, his wife is on the—Well that's the one run the senior citizen's place. Yeah, they come out there to eat. That boy runs the cattle. Here comes one from over this way. That's going out towards Montgomery. We'll go back this way. This is the way we come to the site. Yeah, we're turning right here, to the right. Stacey Scales: Right here? Charles Pollard: Yeah. That just carries us back up into town. But that's the Baptist church there. That's the church over yonder, by the depot. One of my friend's, Bob, stays there. He came from Chicago and bought that house. A White lady had it. Yeah, and he stays out there. He has him one of those—What you call those— Stacey Scales: A two car garage? Charles Pollard: —Got him a short, new trucks. It's a van now. Tywanna Whorley: Minivan? Charles Pollard: Huh? Stacey Scales: You can get melons for a dollar. Charles Pollard: Y'all want to stop and get one? Tywanna Whorley: I don't know where we're going to put it. Charles Pollard: Put it in the car. Stacey Scales: In the car. In the thing. Charles Pollard: We buys them there. Stacey Scales: Oh, really? They're just a dollar. Charles Pollard: Yeah. I'll buy one for you. I'll buy one myself. Didn't you say a dollar? Stacey Scales: Yeah, that's what I saw. I guess that's the— Charles Pollard: Pull on up there. I know him. If we can get up. Tywanna Whorley: Yeah, he got that sign. Charles Pollard: Is they—Yeah, pull up in there. Tywanna Whorley: Melons for a dollar. Charles Pollard: Huh? Stacey Scales: Do you know him? Charles Pollard: Yeah, I know him. That's all right. Stacey Scales: Okay? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Well we can keep on. Yeah, that way, all these people around here, they're friendly people. Been knowing them all my life. And he just married this girl here. Stacey Scales: Oh, yeah? Charles Pollard: Yeah. He just married her. She married one of the Reynolds' boys. And I had an uncle stayed back in there in an old shack. That was old Dr. Samuels' old home there. He have an old shack back there, and my uncle stayed in it. He stayed drunk all the time. He had a shack back there. He stayed in it, look out and the see the moon shine. Shining at night, in the old house. That's old [indistinct 00:26:46] house. Right there, that's John Candler's house. He has 220 acres there, adjoining me. I'll go back down there under the hill, below the service station. Stacey Scales: This way? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Yeah, there. You know where you are now. You can come to the old circle anytime you want now. You done made a circle around. Stacey Scales: All right. Charles Pollard: Yeah. Yeah. And you know you're around in town, looking, and don't go too fast. And just ride it [indistinct 00:27:17]. It's just playing on different people. I never did have no trouble out of people and I've been around here all my life. Stacey Scales: How did you manage to survive? Like— Charles Pollard: Nothing. Just going on working. Stacey Scales: Oh, okay. Charles Pollard: Yeah, and they were all the time talking about the integration and things. I ain't never seen no difference in nothing since I been coming up here. These White folks go everywhere, fishing, but didn't go to church together. Well, we still don't go to church together. Stacey Scales: Right. Charles Pollard: No. Stacey Scales: Did anyone ever get jealous of you because you had a lot of land? Charles Pollard: No. No. Always did— Stacey Scales: You said they took your land once. Charles Pollard: Yeah. We had plenty of land. Well we're going to drive by the place. And you see, we used to work all this land. And what people's going to hire you? What if they didn't have nowhere to stay and nowhere else? They had to work on halves. And my daddy was working people on halves. When I was big enough— Stacey Scales: What's half mean? Charles Pollard: Huh? Stacey Scales: What do you mean, "on half"? Charles Pollard: Got them working on halves. Cotton and corn, and he'd take it over. Stacey Scales: Was he good to you? Charles Pollard: Well he had his half, and if it ain't pay enough out, he'd take all of it. But my daddy didn't do that. It was White folks had plenty of them on it. But you see, I ain't never worked on half. My old great-grandmother had a home when I was born. She had 20 acres they gave her. This was still back in slavery time. Yeah, we used to work this land right here, back down to my house. And I worked for the grass farm down there, going towards Tuskegee. That grass farm, I worked that one year. Made so much cotton on it, that man wouldn't rent it to me the next winter. Wanted me to work it on half. I said, "Hell no. That's slavery time stuff." And I said, "In other words, y'all don't like Black folks no ways. I ain't studying about you. If you don't want to rent it, I could—I had more land than I could use." Charles Pollard: That's where that old planter mill—Those are Coloreds all out there, but the Whites run the store. Well a Colored lady be in there sometimes, they say. I think she got a Colored lady behind the—That's one of those good old White folks right there. She made that out there. She got a grandchildren a pool right behind that fence. That's her house right there on the—That's her son there, and she's in the other house. That's her whole family there, and she built that pond. She has a lot of grandchildren. Charles Pollard: That's one of our boys out there. Now that, he bought that place. He call himself buying it, I don't think he do it that much. That's a block school. That's where the headstart went. Now the place there, from here on back, down on right where we used to work— Stacey Scales: We've got to stop at the school and church. Charles Pollard: Yeah, that's where we were—Go up under there. That way. You can pick up some, just take it easy. I used to work on both sides of the road. I made 30 bales of cotton from right there, down to the line yonder. Back where that shed in the road done got off the slab, that's where it crosses, right there. Right there where the car is now. That's where they go across the road. Another belonged to Colored people, on down below me. Yeah, from right on—The first house over there, out the sink. Charles Pollard: Well Colored people used to live along in here, but they were working on halves, and some of them were renting. Don't nobody stay there. All the older heads gone, and him that got it, he's getting old and they ain't got no children. Nobody got land no how, because when they're dead, they're gone. Ain't nobody still out. This Colored all right here. That boy now, he got a pretty good—We sold him some land. At least we didn't sell it to him. Boy that had it got mixed up with the—We'll turn in here now. We'll turn in. Stacey Scales: Oh, yeah? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Look. Watch. There you go. Come on over where you won't hit your door. See, now we're moving too slow, huh? Stacey Scales: Mm-hmm. Charles Pollard: You know you got—You've still got to wait yet. Got to get him up here with some dirt here on this road. I didn't know it was in this kind of shape. They all had to—Go right up in the front there, if you want to. Stacey Scales: Right here? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Yeah. See where it's marked off here, where you—if you want to take—Just don't hit it. Tywanna Whorley: [indistinct 00:32:29]. Charles Pollard: Want to make some pictures and [indistinct 00:32:32] one thing or another? Stacey Scales: Yeah. I just need to—We're going to reconnect this when you get out. Charles Pollard: —I been tending all my life. All of my life. Tywanna Whorley: And it was organized in 1870? Wow. Charles Pollard: Yeah. That's a stone up there where— Tywanna Whorley: In 1870. Charles Pollard: Yeah. Tywanna Whorley: That's a long time. Charles Pollard: Yeah. My daddy was born in 1881. He left us in '77. Tywanna Whorley: Oh wow. Charles Pollard: He left on. Of course all us done outlived him now. But my mother died young. She was on the Grimmett side. Stacey Scales: What's the—Who is the earliest minister you remember listening to? Charles Pollard: Was he a Woods? Is it on there? Tywanna Whorley: The earliest one? Stacey Scales: Woods? Charles Pollard: Woods or Young. Caleb Young, I think. Was some of the first ones. Stacey Scales: Okay. Charles Pollard: First ones for me, was W.M. Burton. Burton Funeral Home, here in Tuskegee, right on Arbor Road. Well Burton runs all the undertakers now, you know. Stacey Scales: Okay. Charles Pollard: Yeah. When I was big enough, it was Poe and another one. Day and Poe. Now my mother and wife, they came up, the horses brought them up to the cemetery. That's what we had back there then, didn't have no vaults and things. Just had a wooden. Stacey Scales: Right. Charles Pollard: Yeah. I married when I was 18 years old. Stacey Scales: Really? Charles Pollard: Yeah, I married too early. But anyhow. Stacey Scales: You said, "too early"? Charles Pollard: Yeah. That daughter there, you see there? That's my daughter. Stacey Scales: Oh, really? Charles Pollard: Yeah. And she's 69. She was born in the '20s too, 1925. Stacey Scales: For real? Tywanna Whorley: She doesn't look it. Stacey Scales: Yeah, she doesn't. Tywanna Whorley: She looks young. Charles Pollard: Well she's—That's when she was born, '25. 1925, March the 22nd. And I lost my wife in '25, second day of July. And her aunt raised her, but all of them gone on. And then her husband and brothers, all of them gone on. Stacey Scales: Going to walk down to the school? Charles Pollard: Huh? Stacey Scales: Going to walk down to the school? Charles Pollard: Oh, yes. If you want to walk down there, you— Stacey Scales: Okay. Charles Pollard: Yeah, we'll walk down there. And talk and make some pictures, if you want. And talk. Yeah, this is my place. Tywanna Whorley: Do they still hold meetings in the church? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Tywanna Whorley: I mean, in the school. Charles Pollard: They don't—They just have different little meetings down there, and sometimes they have picnics. On a Saturday, raise a little money. Some of them want to raise a little money for something, put on a fish fry. Tywanna Whorley: Oh, a fish fry? Charles Pollard: Fish fry. Top of that, where we're going up there, that's where I used—I bought a place up there, $5500. I bought it from the old White folks up here in those—Bought it from a Yankee, and he was from [indistinct 00:35:52], Illinois. Old man Boeing. I bought that place down on top of the hill where our cemetery is. Stacey Scales: Did the people from the church make the school? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Stacey Scales: Or they put the [indistinct 00:36:02]— Charles Pollard: Yeah, they put up that school. That school was put up—When that school was put up? I reckon, '45. Tywanna Whorley: 1945? Charles Pollard: Yeah. I imagine that, back then they put it there because when I was little—because I didn't go to school there any. Tywanna Whorley: Okay. Charles Pollard: Because I had got—You know I wasn't married. Wait a minute, I wasn't married at that time, but I had got married during the time that school—Anyhow, it was built along there, in there. It was built in the '30s. Yeah. Tywanna Whorley: So it was a one room? Charles Pollard: Oh, no. That's just like up here. It was—Now in the old school, where I went to, it was sitting right out there, about those pines there. Tywanna Whorley: Okay. Charles Pollard: And it was just a one room, and it had a little house on each side for our jackets. And it had a little—had something you could put your lunch in there. We'd bring a lunch to school. Sometimes I'd just put mine in my pocket. Tywanna Whorley: In your pocket? Charles Pollard: Yeah. But had me a butter biscuit or something. Have a sausage patty in there, a slice of meat, and wrap it up in paper and just put it in my pocket. Just to the schoolhouse. And we had to pull off our jacket. We'd just let our lunch stay in our jacket. Tywanna Whorley: What happened to the school? Charles Pollard: Where the other one, the old school, they tore it down. Tywanna Whorley: Oh, they tore it down? Charles Pollard: Yeah. And built that [indistinct 00:37:52]. Tywanna Whorley: So did the money for this school come from donations from the church? Charles Pollard: Yeah. People built around Shiloh here. Built that school. Oh, they got a little help from the—Ms. Roosevelt was the first one came down here. Ms. Roosevelt, she came down here with those coons and things. You know Tuskegee didn't want that John Andrews Hospital. I mean, VA— Tywanna Whorley: VA Hospital. Charles Pollard: —VA Hospital, down here. Ms. Roosevelt came down here and got with those coons, and all of them out of Washington. Told them that if they didn't let those boys in there, they would blow it up. Yeah. Stacey Scales: How would you all get to school? Charles Pollard: Huh? Stacey Scales: How would you all get here? Charles Pollard: Walk up here. Stacey Scales: How far was that? Charles Pollard: Back down to the house, a mile and a quarter. You better not be late. Tywanna Whorley: Really? Stacey Scales: What would happen? Charles Pollard: Children now, you can't get them up on time to catch the bus. Catch the bus, can't get them up on time to catch the bus. You know children, most of them out there in the country, they stay in the bed too late. And then the—See, TV's running these young children. Of course, that's all—I've got three there. Yeah, three there. Willie, Bubba, and Carla. They've got their eyes set on that TV, and I say, "Y'all children, y'all sitting down there looking at the—looking in your book and you're seeing the TV. Can't learn like that. Need to cut it off." But you see, all of them looking. And that's it. Charles Pollard: This where we were when that Tuskegee study was going on. Stacey Scales: Oh, really? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Stacey Scales: Hm. Charles Pollard: Right up here on top of this hill. Got a bunch of us up here. Nurse Rivers, Dr. Smith, [indistinct 00:40:02] Long. Tywanna Whorley: Did they—How long did they hold school here? I mean, was it year round or like six months, or [indistinct 00:40:13]? Charles Pollard: That's what I was telling you, that we didn't have nothing but seven months school. Tywanna Whorley: Seven? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Seven months, that's all I had. You left there and—Well later on, and we went to [indistinct 00:40:30]. Yeah, I went up and down those steps many of time, but I didn't go to school there. But you know, in and out. Tywanna Whorley: Yeah. Charles Pollard: Yeah. Tywanna Whorley: So is it like two rooms in there now? Charles Pollard: Oh, yeah. That whole—See, you go in either one of these doors, and— Stacey Scales: Can we go in it? Tywanna Whorley: It's probably locked. Charles Pollard: It's locked, ain't it? This here—Yeah, it's locked. I don't know, it's just benches sitting around in there. Nothing but benches I don't— Stacey Scales: [indistinct 00:41:12]? Charles Pollard: Huh? Tywanna Whorley: The benches? Charles Pollard: You see, they been stopped school there. See, all the schools you see—Reverend Padgett, y'all heard me talk about Reverend Padgett, he's the first one started the—all of the children—He bought a bus himself and hauled the children to Tuskegee. For two years. Tywanna Whorley: Two years? Charles Pollard: Before the county took it over. He was 63, I think, when they—These children were already riding the bus. They made them buy those yellow buses. What, some horses up there? Stacey Scales: Yep. Charles Pollard: Yeah, plenty of those things around here. Stacey Scales: So why did they build a school up here? Charles Pollard: Well that's where—It was built along in the '30s, during that study. Stacey Scales: Okay. Charles Pollard: Because that's where we were, at the church. And— Stacey Scales: So they built it specifically for the study, or they just built it because [indistinct 00:42:15]— Charles Pollard: No, this was a school. Stacey Scales: Okay. So they just built a school for the kids? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Stacey Scales: Okay. Charles Pollard: Yeah. That's where our school was at. Tywanna Whorley: So did everyone who belonged to the church, did their children come here, or did you have other children from the other community able to play? Charles Pollard: Just in this community. Tywanna Whorley: Okay. Charles Pollard: It was another—Now we're talking truck stop over yonder, on the freeway. Well people on that—Between here and down there, it was school back in there, Clemonsdale. That's where they went to. My daddy was born down there, by the truck stop. Tywanna Whorley: Who built this school? Charles Pollard: Huh? Tywanna Whorley: Did—I mean, who built it? Did— Charles Pollard: You know, county. County and the Tuskegee Institute. Tywanna Whorley: Oh, wow. Looks pretty sturdy. Stacey Scales: What was the name of it? Charles Pollard: Huh? Stacey Scales: What's the name of the school? Charles Pollard: Shiloh School. Stacey Scales: Shiloh School? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Yeah. Tywanna Whorley: Did you have kindergarten all the way up to sixth grade, or— Charles Pollard: Yeah. Tywanna Whorley: Really? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Well at kindergarten, you know it started out here way—Just a few years back. Stacey Scales: Let me get a shot. Charles Pollard: From the first grade. Tywanna Whorley: Uh-huh. Did—The teachers, did y'all hire the teachers, or did the county hire them? Charles Pollard: County hired them. Tywanna Whorley: Oh, really? Charles Pollard: Yeah, county paid them. Tywanna Whorley: Black teachers? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Yeah, the county paid them. Tywanna Whorley: What? It's been lasting a long time. Charles Pollard: Oh, yeah. Yeah, it's been there a heap of years. Because you see, '63, they cut—All them in Tuskegee. And you see, all—because the children up here, they all went to school here, because they didn't go down below to Tuskegee, to that school. That's the reason I'm telling you to go over to North Salem. Wasn't no point in leaving North Salem, just to get any grades down there. Below Tuskegee. All the other counties went in though, but this one up here didn't go. We stayed here at this school. And then they were going up there anyway, because you see, they ain't had no schools here in 30 years. Just had them little—You know how people have kindergarten— Stacey Scales: Can we get a picture of you in front of the school? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Tywanna Whorley: Well we've got to walk over— Stacey Scales: If you could stand right here, I could just kind of— Tywanna Whorley: Turn around. Stacey Scales: —do a background. Charles Pollard: Yeah. Tywanna Whorley: You can turn around. I— Stacey Scales: You want to get further? That's good? That's good. Okay. You're ready? Charles Pollard: Ready to say something, so tell me. Cheese. Cheese. Yeah. Charles Pollard: Yeah, and Nurse Rivers, she made a heap of trips up here. She finally died. Lost her mind up there in Opelika. I had to go up there and get here. Stacey Scales: So where would you all eat in here? Charles Pollard: Huh? Stacey Scales: Where would you all eat in the school? Charles Pollard: We'd bring our lunch. Stacey Scales: Oh, yeah? Charles Pollard: Yeah, bring a lunch from home. And some of them back there then, you know it just depends on whether—who raised them for you to—Because I'll tell them, "I don't like somebody said 'poor.' I ain't been poor in my life." I've been working all my life. I had pneumonia in '21. I had it again in '31. And the same doctor, doctored on me both times, he died in '33. He was gone the next November. He had double pneumonia. He went in. But he had one child, and he was in the post office, but he retired from the post office. I've been on this ground all my life, church and school. Stacey Scales: So the church owns all this land right here? Charles Pollard: Yeah. Yeah, they own this. Tywanna Whorley: Right. And you better not be late getting to school too.