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<v ->I was trying to determine that solitary confinement</v>

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could cross the line into cruel inhuman

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and degrading treatment or even torture.

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And I used the provision of mental torture as a basis.

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And then I used a scientific literature

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psychiatric literature, mostly that says that after 15 days

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of being alone and not having meaningful social contact

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with anybody, your mind starts working differently.

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The same literature ascertains that in some cases

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not all, but it could be irreversible consequences.

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So basically the argument then that I made was, you know

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first we should prohibit prolonged solitary confinement.

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And the reason we should prohibit prolonged solitary

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confinement is that short term solitary confinement

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may have some legitimate uses.

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For example, to protect someone

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who would be vulnerable if

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left in the general population

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or to isolate a predator

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that could be dangerous to others

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or for very serious disciplinary offenses.

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But then it should be short term and

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and it should be surrounded by due process guarantees.

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And, you know then trying to determine

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what constitutes prolonged solitary confinement.

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I came up with a somewhat arbitrary term of 15 days

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but I say somewhat arbitrary because it is born from, or

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or borrowed from the psychiatric literature.

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It's not arbitrary in that sense.

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I'm sure there are people who can be 20 days

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in solitary confinement and the next day they're fine.

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But if you're going to legislate a cot

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then what data are you going to use?

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And I later in, you know, in public speaking, I said, well

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you know, maybe 15 days for absolute confinement, but

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if you have a couple hours a day that you can exercise

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maybe a slightly longer term would be okay

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but it should be counted in days.

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Not even in weeks, not even

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and certainly not in months or years.

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And the other thing that I called for

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was a complete ban on indefinite solitary confinement.

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Because if you don't know, you know

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when it's going to end it, it stands to reason that it

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it just adds to your anxiety to say the least.